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Post 09 Oct 2020, 07:52 • #1 
Guide
Joined: 06/30/20
Posts: 255
Ok so obviously there is a TON of info on this forum about reel seats. I have read through many of the threads but am having a hard time putting it all together. Here's what I'm hoping to do with this thread - learn why you as a rod builder choose one reel seat over another. Obviously there are aesthetic choices to consider. But there are also functionality choices to consider. And there may be a focus on authenticity, back to the original rod if its a restore job.

So here's the (multi part) question. What do considerations play into YOUR selection of a reel seat for your rod? When do you choose uplocking, downlocking, or slide band?

To make it easier, lets say you have the following rod blanks in your hands today. What reel seats would you choose for them?

7' 4/5wt Fisher blank (medium brown color)
7' 3wt Kabuto blank (white color)
9' 4wt graphite blank (black)

Yes I know this is a glass forum but I thought the graphite rod might throw some different ideas into the mix for reel seats.


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Post 09 Oct 2020, 08:39 • #2 
Guide
Joined: 11/23/17
Posts: 314
Location: Lehigh Valley, PA
A little lazy on my part, but below is my response to the counterweighting thread. What I'm getting at is when I mock up a rod with guides, a grip, and a taped on reel (maybe a bolt slid into the bottom of the blank to simulate skeleton weight) I can best determine reel seat type and material for a given blank.

With short, light-line blanks (in my hands) a heavy material, down locking reel seat wouldn't balance the rod well. With that configuration and a reel installed I wouldn't expect to feel the rod load while casting. So I'd be testing with a light, up locking reel seat. YMMV though.


Developing optimal “feel” with a fiberglass rod build requires a bit of personal input into the process. Fly line type, grip style, grip diameter/length, reel weight, reel position relative to your hand (uplocking vs downlocking reel seat), reel seat skeleton material (light aluminum vs heavier nickel silver), wood insert weight, all contribute to the feel of the finished product. Mocking up the blank with various inputs will move the builder in the direction called for by the blank.

Last month I lawn cast a friend’s personally built fly rod (blank rolled by a highly respected domestic rod builder). A very nice build, but as I cast the rod I felt the need to slide my hand down against the reel. The rod felt a little light out front. If building for myself this blank would have a light weight uplocking reel seat, and a grip that put my hand closer to the reel. Edit: This is just one example of course, I have fiberglass rods that feel great with downlocking reel seats.

But that’s just me, other builders who would mock up the blank might come to a very different set of conclusions.


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Post 09 Oct 2020, 13:44 • #3 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2513
Location: South of Joplin
I detest up locking reels, and years ago I was convinced by magazine writers that they were special to the point of changing the reel seats on three rods I owned at the time.
This very week I took the FF807 out and it reminded me of the folly of up locking- I simply don't have the three hands needed to efficiently mount the reel on one of these- one hand to hold the reel one hand to hold the rod upright and away from obstacles and two hands to manipulate the rings and screws, wait that's four hands. The rod will soon be for sale, think that's the third time this year that used it and got irritated each time.
I prefer a down locking aluminum seat that Phillipson (patented maybe?) used, but any down locker is always easier than any up locker. (unless the rod is short enough to hold tip down) because the thumb of the rod hand can push the upper ring up while the reel is seated, thus freeing two hands.
(on a side note I don't think anyone ever had a "balanced" rod/reel- a foot of line out or in spoils the finest balance)


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Post 09 Oct 2020, 13:52 • #4 
Guide
Joined: 12/20/19
Posts: 101
Location: Christchurch, NZ
PENZZZ makes good points.
I too find times when I like to slide my hand closer to the reel .
In doing so an up locking seat is not a comfortable solution.

The blanks you mention are trout weights and as such you are unlikely to be using large heavy reels so you have many options.

I prefer double slide bands over a cork spacer for the following reasons.
One....light weight
Two....super functional
Three....comfortable. A simple slide band with no protruding knurling and smooth surface I find to be non irritating
Four....Aluminum rings over a cork barrel provides gorilla grip with very little pressure
Five.... a .375” wide band with the correct taper will hardly distort the cork at all

Also I can make them myself which adds to the appeal.

Michael


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Post 09 Oct 2020, 15:22 • #5 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 04/20/07
Posts: 8933
Location: US-ME
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=41716&hilit=precious+metal

The most adaptable in custom builds. A section of the barrel can be cut out if an insert is wanted, and they can be shortened to liking as long as the span between hoods is sufficient for any reels that would be used. Downlocking will be the most likely position, but those with a removeable plug can be mounted uplocking, with the threaded length shortened, keeping the reel toward the butt of the rod, and reducing the length of the extended portion--again, so long as clearance is left for mounting the longest foot of any reel that would be used.


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Post 09 Oct 2020, 17:00 • #6 
Guide
Joined: 10/30/18
Posts: 203
Location: SF Bay Area
My primary considerations choosing reel seats are: reel security, hand comfort, and arm comfort. My meat hooks tend to the large size and elbow tendons to the sensitive. I typically choose the following to accommodate:

1. Pocketed cap & ring - 7-8 foot, 3-5 weights. A smooth transition from grip to seat and ring allows comfortable hand positioning on rods that typically have shorter grips and are used in all manner of casts.

2. Downlock - 7-8’3”, 5/6 weights. Typically my utility rods with longer grips and balance best in this configuration.

3. Uplock: 8’3”+, 6-9 weights. The shock to elbow stopping forward/back cast with heavier long rods is much more tolerable to me with the reel moved up from the butt just a bit. I add fighting butt to longer 7+ weights and that helps considerably.

Left-right: 8’8” 8wt Fisher, 8’3” 6/7wt Fisher, 8’ 4wt *********, 7’ 4wt Barclay (all need wrapping)


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Post 10 Oct 2020, 02:57 • #7 
Guide
Joined: 09/12/12
Posts: 120
Location: France
I favor uplocking but shortened to not have excessive length exposes at the butt.
Below 8’ cap and ring are my choice.


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Post 10 Oct 2020, 14:28 • #8 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 12/27/14
Posts: 1501
Location: ON, Canada
I’ve become a big fan of the garrison style screw-lock - either uplocking or downlocking


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Post 12 Oct 2020, 13:11 • #9 
Guide
Joined: 02/06/16
Posts: 330
Location: US
So, I hate uplocking reel seats. I just hate the way they look on a fly rod and this is completely aesthetic as I have had uplocking reel seats (on the litany of Sage rods I had) before the first time I moved away from graphite and got into boo. I cast those Sage rods just as well as I do with rods that have a downlocking reel seat. That extra inch or 1.5 inches that sticks out looks awfully awkward.

So my preference is for downlocking compared to uplocking.

Although also have to admit I would go for a cap and ring before a downlocking and in some cases a dual ring setup but only on short light line rods.


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Post 12 Oct 2020, 20:36 • #10 
Master Guide
Joined: 01/21/12
Posts: 462
Location: US-NY
Down locking cao and ring with pocketed but cap and cork insert on all three rods.


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Post 13 Oct 2020, 10:07 • #11 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 12/05/06
Posts: 2099
Location: US-PA
I am not a builder so my preferences are not important, however I have more than a few custom rods.

With just about every custom rod own, the builder had a preference which I deferred to if it was a signature thing. Many only gave the option of a single uplocking model, a screw-locking down locker for the longer, heavier models (or by preference) and a cap & ring.

With the exception a few where I specified, if I left it up to them I most often ended up with a cap & ring reel seat which is just fine by me.


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Post 13 Oct 2020, 10:38 • #12 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/07/18
Posts: 382
Location: Reston VA
Swimming against the current a bit but IMO ...

Uplocking threaded rings are my choice on most ltwt graphites because they are more secure and the reels do not touch the ground when the rod is rested upright. Also, modern ltwt reels balance well enough in that position. And you have a short butt to use as a grip surface while palming the reel with your off hand and to keep the reel a bit further away from clothes and other danglng gear. I do not find mounting the reel to be all that much more difficult on uplocking reel seats.

BUT with longer heavier glass and bamboo rods, rear locking real seats allow moving the reel back a bit and that does give you more options in choosing reels to balance the rod, And even short fighting butts on those rods provide all the advantages cited above. On longer rods 10 ' and up with longer butt extensions, the rear locking seats really help in countering tip heavy predelictions .


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Post 14 Oct 2020, 14:55 • #13 
Guide
Joined: 12/16/15
Posts: 135
Location: MSP
I'll bite.

It's situational for me. Bigger rods (8-1/2ft and up, usually 4wt+ and faster action, especially if graphite) take uplockers, unless they're 2-hand rigs - those usually get downlockers. Cane rods 8ft+ and 5+ wt usually get uplocking seats.

Trout rods under about 8 foot, older/ vintage, or slower rods under ~6wt - they get downlockers, usually cap-n-ring seats on rods about 3/4 wt and down but not always. Almost all of my downlock seats are cap-n-ring. I really don't like down-threading seats on anything but switch and spey rods, and even then it's a little dicey.

There are always exceptions to the rules as well: my 082 Little ONE is a fast graphite 0 wt and I turned an uplocking seat in to a downlocker, and gave the rod a cute little fighting butt by putting a cork ball over the reel seat hood at the end of the rod. It's a neat, neat little rod.


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Post 02 Nov 2020, 21:25 • #14 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/02/14
Posts: 541
Location: US- Northern CO
uplocking seats leave a but end of the rod sticking out to catch your line and when that happens i always swear to never use another up locking seat again. so down locking and cap and ring seats only. wish i could find a seat like the fenwicks in the new market. they hold new and old reels like a rock. been tempted to buy broken fenwicks just for the seat.


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Post 02 Nov 2020, 22:46 • #15 
Master Guide
Joined: 02/04/12
Posts: 710
Location: SE Pa
I prefer down-locking - but up-locking protects the reel when I need to “stab” the rod butt into the dirt to help me crawl up a bank and out of a creek. LoL - I use my equipment hard, but I care for it too.


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Post 06 Nov 2020, 22:28 • #16 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/02/14
Posts: 541
Location: US- Northern CO
@springer1 made me laugh, you should fix a wade stick end on the but of your rod so you can find your way across the water too.


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Post 14 Nov 2020, 07:07 • #17 
Sport
Joined: 07/20/20
Posts: 36
Location: Long Island, NY
If classic looks is important, the down lockers are lovely. Functionally, I don't like to put the reel in the dirt. Since the OP mentioned graphite, trying to balance a rod by moving the reel down away from ones hand causes a problem, especially with longer, faster/stiffer rods. It makes stopping the rod at the end of the casting stroke much more difficult. Not a problem with softer rods where acceleration is not an issue.

Tony


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Post 14 Nov 2020, 08:52 • #18 
Master Guide
Joined: 02/04/12
Posts: 710
Location: SE Pa
xNYkid wrote:
@springer1 made me laugh, you should fix a wade stick end on the but of your rod so you can find your way across the water too.

LoL, here in SE Pa, some of the best areas are really tough to access and on top of that, staying stealthy means some "creative" approaches. I really do take good care of my equipment but I also figure it's meant to be fished & make memories. I'm 68 and give thanks that I can still act like a kid.


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