Why would anyone want to weigh a fly line? To establish the line weight, of course. I've purchased many a used reel spooled with an unknown fly line. Some of these lines are perfectly good - once you know the line weight. And many NEW fly lines are not made to AFTMA standards (more later).

The AFTMA standards were developed in the early 60s to reduce the confusion of matching a fly line with a fly rod. The standards are simple. The first 30 feet of fly line, excluding the level tip section, is weighed. The weight in grains determines the line weight.

I use a cheap little digital scale for weighing fly lines. The scale is set to weigh directly in grains. I set up the scale with a small platform level with the pan of the scale.



I mark off the first 6-12" of fly line with a little tape (if I don't know the tip section length, I assume 6"). From that point, I measure an additional 30 feet of line and mark it with tape. I weigh the tip section of the line (and any attached leader) making sure the remainder of the fly line is supported by the platform. In the photo, there is a bodkin on the scale pan along with the tip section. These digital scales get a little flaky below 10 grains. Add something to the pan, note the weight, then add the tip section and do the math. This gives the weight of the tip section (usually 3-8 grains, this tip was 8 grains).



Next, I coil up the 30 feet of line and the tip section. I weigh this coil. Finally, I subtract the weight of the tip section. The weight is matched to the AFFTA line standard chart. The combined weight of the line in the photo is 193 grains. After subtracting 8 grains for the tip section, I'm left with 185 grains, or a 7 weight line.



Things to note: Each line designation has a range of acceptable weights, i.e., 152-168 grains for a 6 weight line. Any line in that range is a 6 weight. A line outside of that range is not a 6 weight and should not be labeled as such. There are no provisions in the standard for "half" line weights. There are no provisions for determining the appropriate line weight for a fly rod.

I've found lines made before 1995 were made to the AFTMA standards. All double taper lines I've measured were right on the money. But out of a dozen, new, weight forward lines, only TWO lines met the standard. The remainder were heavy enough to almost make the next line designation. One DID make the next line designation!

Editorial: Line makers should either stick to the AFTMA standard or mark the line as something different. Jim Teeny labels his sinking lines with the actual weight of the sinking section in grains. Kudos for Jim! Rio sells non-standard fly lines, most notably the Grand and the Clouser. But Rio is very clear and detailed about their specifications. My measurements show Rio makes lines exactly to their specs. Cortland marks some lines with "half size" designations. Scientific Anglers claims some lines are a "half" size heavy (sorry SA, I measure almost a full line weight hot). Orvis and Cabelas are clueless that their weight forward lines aren't close to AFTMA standards.

What to do? I buy double tapers and Rio lines that meet the AFTMA standards. Does it make a difference? Only in that I wish to know exactly what I am casting. The AFTMA standard was created for a reason and I will try to support it until a better standard is established.

Tom

Tom, thank you for explaining this so clearly.

Wayne,

Actually, no. The first 30 feet of line excluding only the short level tip section. Fly lines have 6-12" of thin untapered tip. This section allows some material for attaching the leader. The level section can be cut back when the leader is changed without cutting into the front taper of the line. The 30 feet for the AFTMA standard starts at the beginning of the front taper.

Also, the section of fly line AFTER the 30 feet of the AFTMA standard has no effect on the line designation. But it can have a huge effect on how the line will cast.compare a line such as the Rio Accelerator with a typical weight forward. The two lines will cast very differently with 45 feet of line outside the guides.

Tom

Hello
I will start this with a disclaimer My comments are not intended to cause any discourse in this important topic.
First I want to state that I agree that the standards should be adhered to by tackle manufactures and they are often put aisde in my opnion to boost sales.

For example we all know that by going up a line weight many times causes a rod to flex deeper and in doing so the rod excerpts more power trough physics.
Deeper flex = more power from the increased depth of the flex curve in most cases.

So from a manufactures point of view lets say for the sake of conversation that you have a rod that loads well with a 5 weight and cast nice to 40' beyond that the flex curve will not allow for much more and the cast starts to fail because the design of the blank will not allow it with the recommended line weight.

If you recommend a line that is a half weight or a full weight above the # 5 standard the rod comes to life.
The manufacturer knows that the 5 weight is a sought after line designation and if you market the rod as a 6 weight sales will drop so what happens next.

Say the Rod is made by the XYZ company and XYZ makes and offers lines as well the sales department before long figures out that by increasing the weight of the XYZ 5 weight line to a half size or full size larger that not only will the XYZ rod cast best with the XYZ line competitors rods will cast better with the XYZ line as well.

So XYZ adopts the practice and strays from the standard, who will know anyway, all that most fly fisherman care about is that it works better and improves their cast they don't weigh their fly lines. All they know is it works!

So XYZ lines are claimed to have a special taper larger body etc etc etc and lines are sampled and people buy them never knowing that all that really happened is an increase in line weight.

This is not true of all line and rod companies and tends to be seen more specialty in lines.

We had a post last year about rod line weight designations and how manufactures sell more rods by designating line weights rather than the old practice of recommending them.

We also had another post that addressed the need for a standard rod line and rod action designation that should be used by all manufactures to reduce the confusion between the terms that manufactures use to describe rod actions.

These posts was picked up by our resident outdoor writer J.C. and he wrote a very nice article for F.F.O.on the topic balance and addresses these very concepts as well as others in reference to balance.

I as you I know build custom rods and I am known as a out of the box rod maker.

If I purchase a blank from XYZ I am not looking to build the standard XYZ rod that you can buy off the shelf.

I have herd only too often "why should I buy a rod from this or that renowned rod builder his rods are built on an XYZ blank."
"I can purchase a standard XYZ blank and build the same rod for $00.00 and save a bundle."
Or "you are only paying for the name etc."
This is a false mind set.

The true Custom Rod Maker is not using the standard XYZ blank he has many options and the knowledge to change the characteristics of the standard XYZ blank and make his custom rod one of his own design.
Also the Maker is many times mixing and matching blank sections to get what he is looking for in his Custom built XYZ based rod.
Or having custom blanks made by XYZ to the Makers designs and Standards!

I have gotten what seems to be a bit off track here but my point is that lets say you build a rod on a XYZ blank that is recommended or specified as a 5 Weight depending on what you use for components and finishing tecniques you can also change the balance of the finished rod and change the line weight needed to have the rod perform with the optimum performance.

I have always been one to see line weight as a recommendation and not cast in stone.

If I cast the standard XYZ rod off the self at my local
outfitter the first thing I ask the sales person is to bring along a another reel or 2 with larger and smaller lines to test the rod with.

In the old days it was common for people to alter fly lines.
Cutting back weight forwards and double tapers to obtain better casting performance as well.
This was mostly seen for use with Bantys and Tournament rods the low and high end of the rod spectrum.

With the Banty the goal was to get the rod to load with little line out and on the other end of the spectrum was to create a shooting line to achieve greater distance.

I have done this myself as I build many rods under 6'6" and Bantys for our tight quartered Eastern Small Streams.
Some company's made specialty lines A & F made a Banty line for their Banty rods and marketed them as specialty Banty lines

Snook and I spent several weeks this spring and lots of trial and error in coming up with a suitable shooting line for his Taylor Bamboo tournament rod and my collection of fiberglass tournament rods.

Lots of cutting and splicing of different lines and mixing line weights in obtaining the best performance for the specific loads needed to get the distance these rods were designed for.
The old school way!

So in closing I will say that I see the straying from the standards for the most part to be driven by sales.

Don't be afraid to experiment with line weights either.
You will never know how your 5 weight really performs with a lower or higher line weight unless you try it.
You maybe surprised that your rod designated for a 5 weight really comes to life with a different line weight.

Tight Lines and Strayed Loops
Andy M

Where do I get one of these XYZ rods, they sound perfect.

Mudd

I look forward to any future XYZ product lines.

Richard,
Here's a link to a Dave Whitlock article on just that:

www.flyfisherman.com/skil ... index.html

Hope this helps,
Pavel

Thank you Tom, Andy and all- I've learned a lot from this thread already. The benefit from hearing all points of view is just great.

Here's my current box of lines stripped from acquired reels. I've told my wife this box is worth hundreds of dollars, but she's not buying it..

Tom mentions a "cheap little scale-" I couldn't make out the brand in the photo, any recommendations out there on my purchasing a particular brand?

Thx much Tom- I'm in for the same scale, that's an amazing price.

I'll probably toss the level lines I have, as I wouldn't use them anyway. If anyone wants them let me know via PM & I'll throw them in an envelope.

The whitish line in the upper left of the photo is gazillion-pound dacron backing, stripped from an old Penn reel (a little large for our NC brookies)

Damn good ideas, especially the first one which is a no-brainer (reusing that fatty salt backing). Thx ffgt