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Post 29 Apr 2020, 13:58 • #1 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/07/18
Posts: 382
Location: Reston VA
I recently have accumulated two 8 1/2' 6 wt glass rods -- a Heddon Pal and FY700 Wonderod from 1965 -- and am having some difficulties in matching reels from my modest stockpile to balance them.

The closest yet is a chunky Young Beaudex that still leaves the rods tip heavy with a balance point just forward of the cork. I have heavier reels but they are 7-8 class and way too big in size for the rods.

Ideally, I'd like to find a reel with palming ring, and some elegance that is not a bank breaker.

And please, I need no advice on ignoring rod/reel balance.

Thanks in advance for pointers.

Heddonist


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Post 29 Apr 2020, 16:35 • #2 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2498
Location: South of Joplin
I don't understand the "too big in size" part, but you can make any reel heavier with lead core line as backing, 11 grains per foot for trolling line, or Cortland's LC13 has 13gr/ft.
I used a 1498 Medalist on all sorts of rods including a couple 9'-5wt graphites.

To help find how much added weight you need, a US penny weighs ~38.6 grains. taping pennies to the reel seat sloud give an idea of how much LC to add.


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Post 29 Apr 2020, 22:05 • #3 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 09/18/09
Posts: 5561
Location: Relocated to the Drought Stricken West.
So the medalists are too light? 1495 or 1495.5? You could try the lead core or lead shot in the spool trick.

I have a suggestion for a couple of slightly earlier reels (though I'm not sure if they are heavy enough)
How about one of of the much earlier Shakespeare perfect's? 1900 or 1899? (I'm not sure which fits a 6wt) or an AuSable. If your wonderrod has a green seat, the green AuSable is a perfect match.


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Post 29 Apr 2020, 22:41 • #4 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2498
Location: South of Joplin
Here's another thought, in a past thread some members listed many reels by weight take a look for something you like that is in the ballpark weight wise- viewtopic.php?f=4&t=52469


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Post 29 Apr 2020, 23:38 • #5 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19078
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
Heddonist wrote:
...
The closest yet is a chunky Young Beaudex that still leaves the rods tip heavy with a balance point just forward of the cork. ...

This sounds perfect to me. I always want my static balance point forward of the grip, and for my 8-1/2' rods, I'm happy with as much as 2-3 inches in front of the cork.


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Post 30 Apr 2020, 06:55 • #6 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 02/26/14
Posts: 3578
Location: US-MN
I don't know about "elegance", but my SA System 2 67, comes in at over 7 oz I think and will balance those rods. It does for my vintage 8.5', though I don't have yours.


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Post 30 Apr 2020, 09:47 • #7 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 12/05/06
Posts: 2087
Location: US-PA
5.5 or so ounces balances out the only two 8"6" glass rods I own right at the winding check although one is a 5wt.

One reel is a fully pimped Medalist 1494 with a 6wt line on it although I think it is a WF6 and the other reel is the last iteration of a 3-1/8" Perfect with the agate line guard however that has a DT5F on it.

I'm guessing the Wonder Rod is heavier than either of my rods so you may be looking for something around 6 oz, maybe a 1495?


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Post 30 Apr 2020, 10:22 • #8 
Guide
Joined: 06/28/18
Posts: 338
Location: Bozeman, MT
I don't know much about weight and balance (unless I'm thinking about flying somewhere in a Cessna) but I use a a bunch of reels on glass rods...other than the1494 being dedicated to the FF84, I use Abels, Ross (R-Series 1-3.5 & G-Series 1&2), Hardy (3 1/8 Perfect & Featherweight) and Daniellson on all the rest, depending on how I feel, what weight line I'm throwing, and length of the rod (longer rod usually means a larger reel) which runs from 7' to 9' and from 3 to 7 wt.

Use what you have, change if it doesn't function as expected...improvise, adapt, overcome...

Have fun.


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Post 30 Apr 2020, 10:56 • #9 
Master Guide
Joined: 05/16/10
Posts: 814
Location: South of Houston, TX
Image
When I want a heavy reel I reach for my brass Sal-Trout 1555. Nine ounces empty, and 11 as I have it spooled with a 6 weight. There's no palming rim, but its able to handle carp nonetheless.
Image

Here's a 8.5' Wright McGill that balanced 4" in front of the cork with a 1495.5 medalist. The reel weighs about 6.5 ounces empty and 8.3 as spooled. This would be another good spot for the 1555.


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Post 01 May 2020, 13:58 • #10 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/07/18
Posts: 382
Location: Reston VA
I found that an Orvis Battenkill Mark V Disc at 6.8 oz spooled has the balance point right at the edge of the corks on these glass 8.5' 6 wts.

It is overkill for the size fish I'll likely pursue with these rods but now I at least know the right weight range.

Thanks for the input.

Heddonist


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Post 01 May 2020, 14:16 • #11 
Master Guide
Joined: 02/04/12
Posts: 705
Location: SE Pa
Ocean city 75 or 76 both have a nice drag and some weight - the 76 is a little larger.


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Post 01 May 2020, 14:20 • #12 
Guide
Joined: 09/22/14
Posts: 203
Location: Charlottesville-VA
Check out a Medalist 1595 RC or 1595 1/2 RC or maybe 1594 RC. I forget which size I have, it's out in the van right now. They are newer but offer the rim control ability you are looking for, and they are a bit heavier than a standard Medalist due to the enlarged spool.

Bob


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Post 01 May 2020, 16:03 • #13 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2498
Location: South of Joplin
Those RC models have heavier frames too because of different metal used in the back plate, but either of those should weigh just over 6 1/2 oz as I have the 1495 1/2DA listed as 6.5 oz. I would not say they are elegant though.


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Post 01 May 2020, 21:18 • #14 
Master Guide
Joined: 10/07/11
Posts: 692
Location: SE MA
Here are the weights of some of the reels I use to balance some of my heavier 8.5 foot rods. Medalist 1595 RC at 7.1 ounces; Johnson Magnetic No. 5 at 7.6 ounces; and South Bend Finalist 1144 at 7.7 ounces. For my 9 foot Fenwick FF90-3 6/7 weight, I like to use my Martin 70 (and the Sears branded Ted Williams 135), which both weigh out at 7.7 ounces.


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Post 05 May 2020, 13:07 • #15 
New Member
Joined: 02/13/20
Posts: 20
Location: US-ME
The Medalist arbors can be filled with birdshot as needed to balance your rod. They used to come with a tag that described how to do this including putting in some cotton wool or flannel to keep the shot from rattling.


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Post 06 May 2020, 08:28 • #16 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19078
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
If you really want to add weight to a reel that otherwise seems great for the application, you can wrap lead-core trolling line beneath your backing.
This SalTrout has 40-yds 15-lb lead core beneath 50 yds backing, letting this otherwise very lightweight reel balance a heavy 8-1/2' H-I Black River combo cane rod.

Image


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Post 09 May 2020, 10:22 • #17 
Guide
Joined: 04/17/12
Posts: 204
Location: Blacksburg, VA
I recently picked up a Shakespeare Beaulite, which I am delighted with and would recommend to you without any reservations. It has enough heft to balance a longer 6 wt rod, has a palming rim, an adjustable click pawl drag with ample adjustment and won't break the bank. What a nice reel and one of the true bargains available. I'll try and learn to post pic's so you can see what it is - as there were several versions made. I believe the one that I have is a derivation of the Young 1525. I bought it for an LKenney 8255 since the reels I already owned seemed much too light for it.


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Post 21 May 2020, 21:47 • #18 
Master Guide
Joined: 06/07/12
Posts: 865
Location: US-CA
So this isn’t a vintage rod, but my ********* Western Glass 5wt is 8’9” long and I found I needed a heavier reel to go with it. I ended up with an LLBean Guide 7/8, which was made by Hardy for LLBean and is essentially a Hardy Marquis. Yes it is big looking, but I guess I am just used to the looks at this point. Here is a pic:

Image


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Post 23 May 2020, 07:29 • #19 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19078
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
jewel combo and great photo


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Post 23 May 2020, 09:09 • #20 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 04/20/07
Posts: 8920
Location: US-ME
Yes! Nice choice.

The eye becomes accustomed to the apparent "large" size, and pretty soon, it will look ideal, which it is. Just as a comparison, remember how 15" rims/tires used to look "large" on 1980s sports sedans when 13 and 14-inch were more common? Today, 13, 14 and even 15 look "small" as 16-18" have become the norm. Conventional wind reels have also been sized smaller when the maker identifies them by line weight because that was often the suggested fit for a WF line with backing. A DT line requires a larger reel--wider spooled, greater diameter, or both. A user of DT lines learned to size-up from the maker's suggestion if it was built into the model designation.

The JW Young 1525 is my go-to for 5 and 6 lines on 8' + rods. Very similar in dimensions to that sweet match shown. The eye/mind, may have been conditioned to "smaller" sizing, but that is going to change quickly when you start enjoying that rig. Thanks for showing.


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Post 23 May 2020, 11:22 • #21 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2498
Location: South of Joplin
Medalist 1498 has always been my favorite reel and it never looks too big on any rod.

I think this struggle for balance is maybe overrated, it's not something I ever thought about prior to www, but last evening I was playing around with a 7'8'' 'glass 8wt and with loaded reels a 1.7 oz difference moved the balance just a bit over an inch; both balance points in the upper third of the grip, no wonder I never gave it a lot of thought. Pull out enough line to make even a short cast and the ''balance'' is gone, eh? How many think of tenths of ounces when hoisting a pound of beverage? The salesmen have brainwashed anglers to have this fantastic perception of weight, seriously most people can't pick up a 3-5 pound object and guess it's weight, never mind knowing what a tenth of an ounce feels like.


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Post 23 May 2020, 15:05 • #22 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19078
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
I've always thought the struggle about the struggle to be overwrought - it's about a personal preference starting point, Trev, and I always want mine up to a few inches front of the grip.
Every time it comes up, somebody mentions line length. Yes, Charles Ritz put the reel in his pocket, but he was tournament casting, not fishing.
Some things are certain - a too heavy reel on a short light rod dampens out feel and increases the tendency to throw tailing loops.
A too light reel on a long heavy rod increases torsion and fatigue on joints, especially elbow.


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Post 23 May 2020, 15:56 • #23 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2498
Location: South of Joplin
I was just surprised at how little difference almost two ounces made in the balance point. That is a shortish heavy rod, so maybe on another rod the difference would be greater.
Personally, I have never noticed the certainties that you mention. I will allow that a long rod increases torsion on old joints but I can't tell that any amount of reel weight reduces that stress.
A few months ago (probably after the last balance discussion) I used the FF85 with the 1494 one after noon and then with 1498 the next day to see if it made discernable difference, it left my shoulder sore both days.
Perhaps if I was better at casting those things would be more apparent to me.


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Post 31 May 2020, 20:12 • #24 
Master Guide
Joined: 02/23/10
Posts: 784
Location: SF Bay Area
Great info above. I'm in the camp of balance making a difference. Your physicality, fishing style, and just plain preference should determine what you choose..

I REALLY like my Young made Sage 106M for 8'6" 5/6wt rods.



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Post 01 Jun 2020, 06:45 • #25 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 04/20/07
Posts: 8920
Location: US-ME
NIce, Holdover ! Getting lazy with my own pics and yours is ideal, that reel being the Sage version of the 1525. It reminds me of another thing, the low profile reel foot such that, although it is a large diameter reel, it sits low to the rod, thus close to its axis, reducing rotational force on the wrist. Although "big" and relatively heavy, it feels more compact to me for that reason. We all have our own idiosyncrasies about what makes a comfortable, dynamic feeling combination. Really, the word "balanced" (as it was often used this way, years ago) can be thought of as well matched components in a system well matched to the user. Ergonomics, as opposed to static weight-based. Weight and its position is definitely a factor. For some users--I'm one of them--quite a weight range can be comfortable. Yet for any one reel, almost always it will feel better to me on a down-locking seat, which does move the static balance point slightly rearward relative to the same rod with an uplocking seat.


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