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Post 23 Dec 2022, 13:24 • #26 
Guide
Joined: 04/20/10
Posts: 113
Location: US California Tahoe Sierras
Looking backwards in time the first & early Fisher Original Graphite's & tapers did this best . Among other company in the day. Lower modulus of carbon's with a great progressive action per the line sizes . We have to ask ourselves why the wheel need to be re invented in today market place with in many cases with to large a price tag . I see this in newer developments in Fiberglass fly rod in today's market . The materials have changed over the decades and the process of pre pegs & scrims . May in this cases the wheel can't be re invented in fiberglass production.
Also what market share it will bring to the Fly Rod Community. I believe it to be very small amount .
This is just on example of keeping "Old school Cool !!!"


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Post 23 Dec 2022, 16:32 • #27 
Master Guide
Joined: 09/26/10
Posts: 547
Location: Montana
Ver,

Below is a post that I made to the nobody likes 4 weight thread that I think will help with the 904L.

“As you know, rod action is a bit of a subjective term. But, I thought I might add a little color regarding the Montana Brothers 904L. If one were to compare it to the old Paul Brown rods, it is true that it is stiffer. In case you are curious about those old rods, there is a neat thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13930
But, one thing those old rods suffered from, in our opinion, was the tips were too light. You had to be careful with the tip when casting them. They really demanded a very consistent stroke from the user. And if the wind come up, as it usually does here in the West, the tip demanded even more attention. So, we designed the 904L, to have a stiffer, more controlled tip. But, once you start stiffening up the tip, you will need to stiffen the lower portions of the rod to help support the tip.

Since many folks have probably never seen one of Paul’s old rods, here is another attempt at a comparison. One rod that I like to use is the old pre-IM6 Winston 9 foot 3 weight 2 piece. But I like to fish it with a 4 weight line instead of a 3. Winston labeled this model as slow in their catalog. The 4 made it even slower. If one were to deflect that old Winston in comparison to the 904L, the 904L will defect more under the same load than that old pre-IM6 903. If one’s opinion is that softness is determined by deflection under a load, than one could conclude that the 904L is softer than the pre-IM6 Winston 903.

However, I feel that deflection tells only part of equation. The other part is how the rod bends or accepts the load. The 904L has a stiffer tip and a softer butt than the old Winston. It has what we at MBR would call a more integrated action or a much smoother bend. If one’s only definition of a soft rod is that it has to have a light tip than maybe it would not be called a soft rod. Our definition is a little more holistic of how the overall rod would bend. I will also add that while the tip is stiffer, it is still supple enough to protect light tippets on big fish.

I am probably in the minority, but I have never cared for the term semi-parabolic as it relates to rod action as there seems there is some disagreement of what a parabolic rod even is among some folks. The late Paul Brown, disagreed with what is commonly associated with what has been coined as a progressive rod. I suspect that some of his rod designing friends felt the same way. To Paul, a true progressive rod was one that had a bend that started at the same point, and the bend increased as the load increased. One might argue that the 904L is closer to that description. The progressive term has really stuck and I don’t think anyone will probably be able to change that. We have jokingly called the action of the 904L as truegressive.

In response to the original post, I would say that I use a four weight the most for the type of fishing I prefer”

With respects to our regular 904, it has a stiffer tip and a softer lower half than the old Scott 904. Our 904 is more of what had been coined “progressive” than the 904L.

A few years ago, some friends and I cast the regular MBR 904 alongside a gen 3 Sage LL 904, a Pre-IM6 Fisher rolled Winston 904, and the current Redington Classic Trout 904. One might argue that the MBR regular 904 was the softest of the bunch, while another might argue that the Winston was the softest of the bunch due to its softer tip. However, the MBR bends more in the lower half than the Winston. It’s interesting to note that each of these rods have a similar static deflection under a load. However, the way that they bend under a load is different.

Sorry, but I have not handled or cast a Fries bamboo rod or a Franke rod, so can’t speak about comparisons with those rods. But, I hope this helps to answer your question.


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Post 24 Dec 2022, 10:24 • #28 
Sport
Joined: 09/21/13
Posts: 71
Location: US-VT
Thank you very much for this thorough response and good insights. I will definitely be looking to get my hands on one to try.


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Post 24 Dec 2022, 10:49 • #29 
Master Guide
Joined: 05/08/06
Posts: 796
Location: RenoNV/FranklinWV
At this time I've only cast and fished the 904L which I don't find all that slow but I'm quite used to medium action rods, I haven't had to deal with all that much wind on the water's fish back here, so I will defer to Dan on this. If wind conditions became an issue for me I would probably go up a line weight or two anyways, generally I wait to between gusts as much as possible in any event.
I guess I could compare the rod very roughly to a couple of Deerfield Power Pack rods I own as to action in the 4 their weight configurations or some of my bamboo's or fiberglass sticks which pretty much top out at 81/2 feet though.

But the 904L is certainly a real pleasure on the stream for me so far, it feels just right, it's very unique for graphite.


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Post 18 Mar 2023, 17:03 • #30 
New Member
Joined: 11/14/19
Posts: 14
Location: US-TX
Anyone know current timing of new rod orders? I'd be interested in one if it's reasonable.

[As always, send an email or call Montana Brothers. They know their schedule better than anyone else. Tom]


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Post 19 Mar 2023, 12:08 • #31 
Master Guide
Joined: 09/26/10
Posts: 547
Location: Montana
Hello Hudson. Thanks Tom for adding that note.

Our current estimated ship date for a 904L would be the June to July timeframe and the May to June timeframe for a 904. This is an estimate and could change next week based on demand or a few other factors. Historically our wait time has ranged from 2 to 8 months. We would love to have rods on hand but that is unlikely to ever happen. We both have professional jobs working 40 to 50 hours a week. So our volume is relatively small, and we do have to balance it with our day jobs and family commitments. We don’t want this venture to be a divorce maker for us either :). So we do ask for some patience from our customers. If have have any questions, you may reach out to us with the email address that is listed on our website.


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Post 19 Mar 2023, 12:21 • #32 
New Member
Joined: 11/14/19
Posts: 14
Location: US-TX
Thanks guys for the quick response. I’ll email you directly with any other questions.


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Post 22 Mar 2023, 05:29 • #33 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 02/10/07
Posts: 1632
Location: The Netherlands
This past weekend I gave a talk about the Catskills at our Grayling Society member day.
Someone asked me when & why I got interested in the Catskills.

My answer:
It was around the mid 2000's when rods got faster and faster (I stopped buying Sage after the SP) and in fly tying more and more synthetics came to the market. Unintentionally, but probably as a reaction to all this 'space age' stuff, that period I got interested in the history of fly fishing and tying, hence the interest in bamboo rods (fiberglass came later) and the Catskills.

My 904L is wonderful. It is not a soft rod but bends deep once under constant load like during a fight. Quite a different animal compared to other 'slower' action graphite rods as they barely bend.

Edit:
My thoughts wasn't put as clear as I thought I did. I need to be back in Montana so my thinking is also in English :lol


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Post 24 Mar 2023, 13:27 • #34 
New Member
Joined: 03/05/21
Posts: 24
Location: New Mexico
Jay, you're message sounded clear to me.

I had been researching the Montana Brothers Rodworks for the past few months now and was very intrigued by the design philosophy of Dan and Doug. I think I became interested because the 904 and 904L rods are so different from what the big rod companies have been selling the last decade or so. It's kind of refreshing for something new and different (going back to the future) being offered in today's fly rod market.

I placed an order for an MBR 904 a few weeks ago and look forward to fishing it on my larger rivers. It will be nice to see more rod reviews of MBRs as they become more visible in the fly fishing world.

Mike


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