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Honking big reel
Post 13 Jan 2021, 13:02 • #1 
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Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19077
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
Decided before I can get around to adding a custom surf rod for my modified 6500CT (say tax return time), I'd add an economy surf spinning outfit.
This also may give me a chance to get on pompano action this winter, but no plans yet.
It's not going to be near as light in hand as my CT custom combo, but when you're putting out bait in the surf, another rod is never in the way.
The economy spinning surf rod was easy, Tsunami Air Waves, 11' H, 1-1/2 to 4-1/2 ounces.
Great reviews and relatively light in hand as 11' surf rods go - Fuji Alconite-K guides, staggered ferrule, with a 7' tip, and moderate action.

The reel was even easier. Tica Samira SBAT.
What really sold me on this $110 reel, Daiwa has sold the same reel series, made for them by Tica, for seven years and ten variations now - the Power Surf and Tournament Surf series, plus an offshore giant, the Pro Cargo.
Daiwa sheds a little weight with aluminum gears, and the $500 to $700 versions have have handles that screw directly into the main gear. but even their $400 version has fewer ball bearings than the Tica.
This thing is big at 21 ounces, but don't get just how big until you get one in your hand.


It needs all of that 90 mm handle length and stand-off, because it has the largest bail I've ever seen.
The gearing and spool diameter also make for a whopping 43" line pick-up /rev - fast for a surf reel, and the torque-y handle will be a bonus on big fish.

It has Tica's worm drive, 13 BB, and a whopping spool stroke of 1.8 inches (45 mm).
You don't get the size of the spool until it's in hand - it looks like a dixie cup.
The nominal spool diameter is 2.8 inches (70 mm).
The spool depth is only 1/10th inch (3 mm), but it holds 300 yards of 35-lb X-braid.
The whole idea is to cast out of sight.

This version spool, btw, is the 3000 - not sold by TicaAmerica.
All sizes of this reel are the same, with five spool sizes offered, from 2000 to 10000.
The reel came by International Priority mail from Taipei. Not bad delivery - 10 days.

It has Tica's great TiN coated line roller (inside and out), and a neat drag design (Daiwa calls Quick Drag).
(Hedgehog sells a 2-BB upgrade for this and the Daiiwa surf reels matching roller.)
The spool drag essentially has two settings - a fine and a coarse. The inner screw attaches the spool and is your primary set drag.
The larger, outer adjustment lets you back from that set, so it functions a bit like a lever drag, and relaxes the drag quite far - easy to relax the drag, and always returns to your max set point.


I hate the giant rubber handle knob, and also not fond of floppy handles. Daiwa's latest $350 version of this reel, the '19 Castizm, has a machine-cut handle using the same oversize hex-shaft. I'm asking Plat to hunt the parts down for me, so I can swap handles and get around to replacing the knob with one I like.
I'm looking forward to taking it to the park for a first cast - will also try my 8'/5500CT combo all out.
__________________________________________________

Like its way-smaller little sister, worm-drive Libra SL, when I had lined 20 yards, could tell the out-of-box spool needed shimming. It was stacking line at the top of the spool and not quite reaching the bottom. Luckily, had the exact amount of shim needed - two white nylon half-thickness shim washers left over from the SL exercise.
I've become pretty competent at removing that first fiber-composite washer from it's denente on the spindle (also have to remove the 2 spool BB w/ spacer, and click-leaf spring).

And the wind result - you can see even shimmed, the start about 40-m began a little tenuous, but the 288-m (315 yds) rated capacity laid close enough to perfect - no bulge at the front or back.
Toyed with the idea of loading the last few meters, but decide to cut and quit while I was ahead - I may have to trim it down later, anyway.
Will be tying Allbright knot to 6' 30-lb Seaguar Gold leader - I left enough tag to get a couple of tries rolling that knot small.

Aside, I noticed re-spooling two Stradic spools this winter, Shimano spool shims compress from use, and also need shimming if you're going to change braid on your spool. Shimano shims are easier to install, but the larger and less convenient Tica shims may be more effective in the long run.


Last edited by bulldog1935 on 15 Jan 2021, 07:29, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Honking big reel
Post 13 Jan 2021, 19:42 • #2 
Sport
Joined: 05/26/17
Posts: 74
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Cool reel! I've enjoyed watching online videos of people using these kinds of reels for surf fishing in Japan (on the Daiwa Japan website) and Italy (on YouTube; they mostly fish for sea bream).


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 13 Jan 2021, 20:14 • #3 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19077
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
thanks - our big surf excitement is bull redfish in late fall spawning, and pompano migrating through the winter.


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 13 Jan 2021, 20:17 • #4 
Master Guide
Joined: 05/16/10
Posts: 814
Location: South of Houston, TX
That spool messes with my mind a bit. There doesn't look to be any room for line. A large arbor spinning reel, as it were.


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 13 Jan 2021, 21:44 • #5 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19077
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
315 yards, "wire" X-braid, 35-lb, but only 0.21 mm thick advertised (stacks smaller).
8-strand, hard center strand, abrasion resistant outer + silicone coating. Bought the braid on closeout - it cost as much as the reel (YGK Oddport - the strongest braid ever made).
I was tenuous about this spool v. the 5000 - neither are sold by Tica America - they only sell the 8000 and 10000 (spools 8 and 12).

I forgot to mention, it's possible to count distance with this line. It's marked every meter and changes five bulk colors every 10 m, repeating every 50 m. But that's what gives it that rainbow effect on the widely wrapped spool. btw, my improved Allbright knots are getting better. I managed to hit one of the green meter-markers.

Left is 0.21-mm, 35-lb X-braid; on the right is the thinnest fluoro, 0.44-mm; 30-lb Seaguar Gold (same diameter as 20-lb Seaguar Red)
That's a 16 full-turn, 5 half-turn knot, coated in Zap - the hardest part is rolling the braid to collapse the loop in the stiff leader. Got this knot on my first try.

Glad I went the 3000 size route (no. 2 spool) - the 5000 spool (no. 4) would need an additional 115 m of 0.28-mm 35-lb braid to fill.
I spent some time on this calculator weighing the options...this is the line stacking calculator, and also links to the simpler line-swapping calculator.
https://www.pattayafishing.net/advanced ... estimator/



http://www.ticafishing.com/fishing-reel-samira-sbat/

After lining, I set the drag to 7 lbs, and it works as advertised - a few CCW clicks on the outer adjustment and you can strip line from the spool by hand.


Last edited by bulldog1935 on 14 Jan 2021, 21:03, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Honking big reel
Post 14 Jan 2021, 13:02 • #6 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 07/11/14
Posts: 1784
Location: urban Colorado
fascinating post, thank you..
didn't know Tica was making reels for Daiwa..
really like that spool design, for the long casts.
Also the drag adjustment is interesting, never felt the need for small adjustments on a saltwater rig but could probably find a use for it once equipped.

I rescued an Orvis 150 SS from a state of corrosion last year, it runs well now, but spent a couple of days to get the shimming right for a reasonable line lay..


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 14 Jan 2021, 13:03 • #7 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 02/27/16
Posts: 2327
Location: US-IL
The spool looks similar to those distance casting rigs used in competitions .I am sure that is no accident.BD you sure specialize in specializing.Great post as usual.


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 04 Feb 2021, 07:07 • #8 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19077
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
It is the same reel/spool used in competition.
The difference in competition, they're using 3 or 4-lb extra-thin, hard copolymer (useless for fishing),
and have it loaded with exactly their target distance plus a little more for hope.
OK, and Tournament-specific reels don't have spool drag.

note the Tica TiN line roller - this is one of the $700 reels without seals, lighter-weight drive, and handle screws directly into main gear.
It has Daiwa cosmetics, but the parts would systematically swap in the Tica.

Doug, the purpose of the drag is max set point for hook-setting - everything you can get without breaking your weakest link, accounting for shock and rod leverage. Again, the same idea as a lever-drag conventional reel.
Fish like mackerel have soft mouths, and you need to back off drag from set so you don't tear the hook from their mouth during the long fight.

On this conventional lever drag, you push the black limit button to move the lever to your max set point - when you back it off, the button pops back up and you can't get back to that max drag again, unless you push the button.

btw, if you want to cast a conventional lever drag, you simply back the lever off to free spool - there's nothing else to the reel mechanism, just gears and spool drag.
The reel is tiny with 25 yds working fluoro on top and 400 yds braid underneath.
______________________________________________

Update on the handle swap. Plat can't get parts for non JDM Daiwa reels, and they couldn't find any that used the hex shaft - the models I could find are all distributed in Europe by Daiwa-DE and Daiwa-Cormoran.
I found one US-market reel, the Daiwa Emblem Pro EX5500. Discontinued reel, but was able to buy the buy the part from Daiwa.
Typical of Daiwa, this handle should allow a knob swap (Daiwa typically only rivets knobs on plastic handles).
I also found a few custom handle makers in UK, where they love casting and fishing these big surf reels (there's a Daiwa carp-fishing model) - no replies yet, and shipping this way is terrible these days (as I learned on my Abu CT project).

Pulled out one of my Libras and measured. While the line roller is the same plasma coating, there's 1 mm difference, so the Libra line rollers remain 1 BB. I'm going to 2-BB on the larger Samira line roller.
Since I was there, couldn't resist this cute comparison - Samira SBAT and Libra SX1500

yeah, the knob on the Samira is larger than the 43 mm spool on the Libra, and almost as big as the whole reel body - I don't mind a 44 mm diameter knob on a big reel, but I prefer it round, and it must have grab options.
_______________________________

More cool - the Daiwa handle for the reel arrived, with two good Daiwa knob bearings.
I found an ebay vendor with a fair price on a Studio Ocean Mark 45 mm round knob, which shed more than an ounce from the rubber knob. I'm a happy camper.

I was really impressed with the SOM knob - it was made for two 950ZZ bearings, and it came with both 5 mm shims and shouldered collars that exactly fit 850ZZ bearings, plus a seal ring at the bottom of the spindle to keep sand out.
___________________________________

My same ebay vendor from Taipei was able to provide me with a spare spool, this time the slightly larger No. 4 spool.
I have him searching for another shallow Tica braid spool that TicaAmerica won't import.
Loaded with 300 m 45-lb YGK X-braid (0.26 mm), and began with 20 m of leftover same-diameter braid for a base wrap to fill the spool from a spool capacity calculation.
perfect line lay result from the good spool shimming.
First photo is about 40 yards, and you can see the spool is almost as shallow, but shallower angle on the arbor.


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 29 Mar 2021, 10:51 • #9 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 07/11/14
Posts: 1784
Location: urban Colorado
I liked the look of these long-cast spools so much, went on a search for a similar thing in a light reel..

Got a new rod, 11' noodle rod by Okuma, rated for 1/16 to 1/4oz, 4-6lb line. It is in fact a glass rod - weirdly it has a graphite tip with a glass butt section.

The only problem is it throws a 1/4oz spoon so far that the spool on a light spinning reel (Shakespeare 2052 in this case) empties out significantly, even with 4lb line. I'm sure I could get another 10-15 yards with a better casting spool.. and down the rathole we go..

I couldn't find anything in the US retailers. Even in the Japan market all the long-cast reels are the big honkers..
Thought I'd bought an Abu Cardinal that was close to what I wanted, 2500S with a shallow spool for the PE 0.8 line that I have waiting, then got an email this morning to say they'd sold out. Drat.



The impetus here is a couple of bass ponds that are no-wading and no-boats. There are weed beds sixty and eighty yards out, which are basically unfished water as no-one casts that far. I am hoping there are some fish hiding out there that I'll be able to reach now..


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 29 Mar 2021, 13:41 • #10 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 19077
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
Great post Doug, and I think you were robbed.
If you can spring for a $100-and-change JDM reel, Asian Portal is the best deal on the internet
The reason, if you fill a $100 basket, they ship Fed-Ex gratis, and you'll have your stuff in 4 or 5 days.
Their website is a terror - note you can narrow the number of pages by cost and brand, and their stock will be the listings with yellow Cart flags.
Spendy, but JDM Daiwa Luvias in a small size sure looks nice.
You can probably also fill that niche with the little bronze Libra SX1500 in post above - the right capacity, great line management, and they cast very well.

The distance casting thing - mentioned on my They're Blue thread, I have an 8' 1-pc light lure surf rod for my Abu 5500 CT reel, and been having a blast casting it, though it only caught a small Mangrove snapper (and a couple of hardheads) off the dock at Arroyo last fall. It would still reach halfway across the Arroyo (way over 200') with a half-ounce Yozuri pencil jig.

I hemmed and hawed and finally went for broke on my larger 6500 CT.
I bought a 14' 3-pc blank, glass tip. It's a ZZiplex Trinity GT.
I'm talking to local Gary Palmejar, Buddahead Custom Rods, famous here for surf rods, about finishing out the long conventional rod.
I'm anxious to take it to the local park open field and see how far the combo will lob 2 oz.
________________________

In the meantime, have my honking big Samira in it's near-done state.
First, UK vendors have finally opened shop after shutting down for a year, and I was able to replace the sloppy 85-mm-pitch factory handle with this well-engineered, solid, folding 70-mm-pitch handle from Weston in UK. Both Tica and Daiwa (made by Tica) use a giant 6-mm handle hex shaft with 3.5 mm handle screw. We don't see many of these reels in the US, but the UK is big on them, with nice aftermarket improvements.
The spindle on Andy's handle doesn't fit my SOM knob, but it's modular, and I'm talking with Andy about making a swap-in Daiwa L spindle.
The real project was adding this "reel stand".


The purpose of the reel stand on an 11' rod is to have a place to keep a big circle hook. What made this so tough was the hex shaft and 3.5 mm handle screw. However, this is also the thread Shimano used on their old square-handle-shaft reels. Found this dirt-cheap Ali Express reel stand with swapping handle screw threads, 3 mm or 3.5 mm.

The M5-0.5 30-mm-long socket screw (also from Ali) matches the thread of the anodized reel stand into the handle screw base. All I really wanted was the handle screw base.
Cut one of the M5-0.5 screws into an all-thread stud - it ended up with red-loctite into the handle screw base. Drilled and tapped matching thread into the Tsubaki reel stand. Fit the stand-off I needed with an IDeR Design reel stand base, and shimmed the whole assembly with M5 spacer and (#10) rubber washer from Bolt Depot.

ps - here's how the Weston handle folds, and lets the big reel fit in a padded case.


Last edited by bulldog1935 on 30 Mar 2021, 06:22, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Honking big reel
Post 29 Mar 2021, 20:55 • #11 
Emeritus
Joined: 06/10/05
Posts: 612
Location: US-MI
Nice


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Re: Honking big reel
Post 30 Mar 2021, 16:49 • #12 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 07/11/14
Posts: 1784
Location: urban Colorado
bulldog1935 wrote:
Great post Doug, and I think you were robbed.
If you can spring for a $100-and-change JDM reel, Asian Portal is the best deal on the internet
The reason, if you fill a $100 basket, they ship Fed-Ex gratis, and you'll have your stuff in 4 or 5 days.


thanks - my seller said they had the reel I wanted in silver instead of black, so that works for me..
I like to buy at about twice the price of the cheapest reels, that seems to get to about 80%-90% of performance of the best reels.

The Daiwa Revros LT 2500 was my second choice, I have the 1000 for UL trouting and it's a good reel.

My brother has a couple of fine-tuned 12 and 14 ft rods, for the Australian salmon run in WA which sometimes needs 100yd-plus casts. There weren't any salmon running when I was there but we took the rods out anyway, just for the fun of hurling spoons way way out..


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