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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 00:15 • #26 
Guide
Joined: 01/04/18
Posts: 303
Location: Belair Maryland/Swanton Maryland
Bassakwards ..
No worries LOL :lol :lol
That’s awesome you fish a TC80
Very classy rod with that euphoric gold …
You should post up on angryvikings
Chieftain thread pint sized park gills
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=75198
We’ve got a few chiefs going on there .

Thanks for setting the record straight on your Striper catch with Bulldog ..

Is yours a red and white wraps or red and black wraps ?
I’ve got one of each ..
Love the black and red ones (my fav 2 colors)

Merry Christmas here is your Chieftans Catalog listing …

The chieftain was second tier rod in the quartet
Classics


Keep em coming guys this is one of my last Phillipson posts …

Better get in while the getting is good ..

Dr Phil


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 03:47 • #27 
Administrator
Joined: 01/10/06
Posts: 7578
Location: Holly Springs, NC
ottobahn wrote:
The Experts may have been an un cataloged pet project of bills .. but, I’d bet any rod in my 105 Phillipson Arsenal you’d like … Up against your e80 that it’s not a Scotchply rod !
Really?? :) My choice?

My best guess is Ron's Expert was made just after the Johnson ownership period, because of the painted blank and the HDH line size marking. That would put it about 1964. The rod is definitely made on a Scotchply blank.

During the Johnson ownership period, Phillipson rods were not sold in clear coat, only as primed and painted blanks (first image below from a 1964 Johnson catalog). The Johnson rods were marked only with AFTMA line markings, no diameter based line size markings (based on the rods in my collection and the 1964 Johnson catalog). The Johnson model numbers were different than Phillipson Rod and Tackle, as were the rod label designs. According to Vic Johnson's Fiberglass Fly rods, Phillipson began using Scotchply just before the Johnson ownership period. During the Johnson ownership, Scotchply began to feature prominently in catalogs and trade advertising (for example see the second image below, also from the 1964 catalog, and the third image from a June 1964 Field & Stream).



My feeling is once Bill Phillipson purchased his company back, he went back to many earlier practices. Limited production of cane rods came back. Line size (diameter) markings came back. As late as 1968, Phillipson rods were still marked with both AFTMA and line size markings (see the Phillipson catalog thread). The model numbers and label designs were reverted to pre-Johnson (I suspect they pulled old templates for initial production). However, Scotchply and the primed and painted rod blanks were now an integral part of the production process.

I have an unused Phillipson Expert that came to me in the original packaging (first image below). I've never fished or even cast the rod. The rod label, wrap style, and mylar accents all echo Scott's rod. Unlike Scott's rod, which appears to be a clear coat Eponite blank, my rod has a painted blank. My rod is identical to Ron's, including the E80 LINE SIZE HDH MADE IN U.S.A. marking (second image below). In addition, my rod has a mylar label still firmly stuck to the cork grip that reads, MADE FROM Scotchply® 3M EPOXY FIBERGLASS (third image below). The packaging is an additional clue to the rod's age. The Phillipson Rod Company's Master rods came packaged in that same plaid cardboard tube and plastic bag (that's right - no cloth bag). I've never seen a pre-Johnson Phillipson in one of these plaid cardboard tubes.



Unfortunately, few vintage rods are marked with accurate birth dates. My Expert may have been made prior to the Johnson ownership (1962). But the painted blank, Scotchply construction, and plaid cardboard tube all suggest post Johnson. The HDH line size marking suggests 1964. By 1967 Phillipson rods were all marked for both line size and AFTMA line weight.


Tom


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 06:30 • #28 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 18333
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
What he said.

Bill Phillipson had pet projects with his hands directly on them.
Certainly Expert was one.

Another was Royal Wand.
You can't imagine the difference between these two rods side by side.
Both marked the same length, same weight, same line rating, same age, diameters measure the same - but the Royal Wand is lighter weight and crisper taper - Bill pulled the blank aside for his pet project.
The blanks weren't made to be different - they came out that way, they were sorted, and Bill hand-picked the best for his special project.

Image

Image

I gave the Fly Fox to my friend, partly for a presento along with a St. Croix, but mostly because he needed it and I didn't.
I don't need one of yours, either.

Image

Thanks Curtis.
For the days we targeted striper, I'll confess to bringing Fisher and Sage graphite, and my salty Izch S-glass.
Best photo was the Fisher, but the fish could spit the A/R dog on the Young Revolution drag - all part of the fun.
Image


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 06:41 • #29 
Guide
Joined: 01/04/18
Posts: 303
Location: Belair Maryland/Swanton Maryland
Wow :eek :eek :eek :eek
You boys got me !
G-man they freakin just killed me!
That is the most crazy cool weirdo retro throwback skunkworks rod ever .
He even reused the old pad print grip and specific wraps with the red Mylar ..
Insane ..

Alright Dr Bulldog which one do you want ??
I wouldn’t shut up so now it’s time for me to put up .
Although I still may need to see underneath that reel seat to satisfy my curiosity lol :lol

Cork sticker could fool anyone LOL :P

Note there will be a market adjusted shipping and handling fee responsible to the winner

Can I interest you in a project mity lite ?
Or how about a Royal 8ft R80 that needs a little love ?
I know you love those 8ft rods Bulldog
Short tip yellow master 86 with no reel seat ?

I’ve got plenty of certified pre owned Phillipsons for you to choose from

Son of a Bisquit Tom you been hiding that rod all these years ..
Shame on you !

My most humble apologies Bulldog ..
a few of your posts on various threads where you say it’s pre Johnson.
There’s one on FFr somewhere deep and I think one on the kayak forum ;) I’m stalking you ..
Thank goodness there is no other mystery phillipsons out here anymore ..
(I can’t afford it ..)
The pacemaker rods were kinda of a mystery to me .
Thought they might be eponite leftovers but I just scored one this week and it’s Scotchply.

I’ve birdogged both expert and pacemaker mysteries in one week

So at least I’ve got that going for me ..

Im turning in or going fishing can’t decide
May need to fish all my Phillips on since I’ll be down one soon .
Cheers
Scotto
Ps
This has Been a killer thread ..


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 08:03 • #30 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 18333
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
If you have an 8' (or shorter) Phillipson L,
offer it to Eric, ARReflections
We had a 2-week pm swap that began and ended with the thinner-butt Phillipson is the rod he's looking for.



You've done your homework on the rods that just didn't turn my head. To me, Phillipson begins and ends with Scotchply.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 08:32 • #31 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 02/27/16
Posts: 2150
Location: US-IL
whrlpool wrote:
I think you mean the sleeve-ferruled Phillipsons. "Tip over" is a different construction. Not sure if P ever made one that way.

Correct as usual.We discussed this in the past.
SLEEVED tip


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 08:44 • #32 
New Member
Joined: 10/11/22
Posts: 18
Location: North eastern PA.
I didn't expect to open up that can of worms!! I guess I should keep mouth shut. Newmin


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 09:04 • #33 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 18333
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
We hope you got your answer. Some of this stuff needs to be fleshed out so if it ever does end up in print, it's correct.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 10:07 • #34 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2201
Location: South of Joplin
@newmin I'm glad you got this started and I apologize if my posts derailed the direction of your request.
As to the choice you asked about, I'd buy the D80DFS just because I think it will be an excellent rod for the work it was intended for and I probably would buy any reasonable priced Eponite based on old posts by flyfishing4goldentrout, he got me intrigued with Phillipsons with his enthusiasm for Eponite. However for the streamers and weighted flies, based my limited experience with these rods, and the information in this thread, I think I'd chose one of the Scotchply rods in 8'6" because that seems to me to be the area my Deluxe works best.
This may be the most informative Phillipson thread on the site; thanks all.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 10:27 • #35 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 02/27/16
Posts: 2150
Location: US-IL
The name Phillipson brought me to this forum.Was on trip with some friends,these guys are top notch multi species anglers.Mostly bass,a couple were professional guides.We were talking old gear and one guy mentioned Phillipson,not fly rods of course but spinning and casting rods.How his dad used nothing but back in the day.I had neer heard of them.A few weeks later a craigslist add for a fishing pole,I saw it was in a tube but that was it.Met the guy he wanted 150.Took it out of the tube and sock and saw the prettiest fishing pole i had ever seen.I gave him a 100 as it said Phillipson on the rod.Turned out to be a JP 800 7'6 in nearly unused condition.A member here who is a friend on different forum suggested this place.So a conversation in a boat freezing our butts off throwing minnows for crappies with guys who think flyfishing is like rowing a boat with one oar landed me here.Gave one of these guys now in his 70s a Gowdy Parametric.It took him all of 10 minutes to cast it 60 feet in front of his house.I am hoping he will actually fish it.He is thrilled i fish a Phillipson just doesn't understand why a waste my time fly fishing.He usually catches and releases 20 bass to my 1 or 2 on a flyrod.I enjoy it just as much.Just want to say thanks to all you guys on here who helped up my game and be at least competent with a flyrod.The history lessons are quite enjoyable also.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 11:33 • #36 
New Member
Joined: 10/11/22
Posts: 18
Location: North eastern PA.
Trev, I don't feel you hijacked my post.,no worries.

HEY wait a minute.... I started this post, where is my free phillipson!! Lol!!

I enjoyed the lively discussion. It may be the best post on figuring out the phillipson for me. Now I guess I just have to cast a few and take it from there. Thanks for the input. Much appreciated.
Newmin
.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 11:58 • #37 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 09/18/09
Posts: 5339
Location: Relocated to the Drought Stricken West.
This thread has been fantastic. And Newmin, if you get a chance to meet up with someone that has Phillipson's, They are definitely worth trying out. My personal preference are the Scotchply blanks. Ottobahn has a lot of my earlier Eponite rods. I thought I was the master of vintage fiberglass, but his library of rods is amazing. The one I was happy to pass on to him was one of RatfaceMcD's old rods. Well loved and with a good maintenance restoration by Andy Manchester. A rod like that has caught more fish than I can imagine and was probably well loved before RatfaceMcD took possession.

Since I am a big Fenwick fan, my Phillipson's seem to sit around a bit more than they should, but I am expecting to get them a lot more use in the next few years.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 13:59 • #38 
Guide
Joined: 03/21/22
Posts: 143
Location: US-PA
Just catching up from being in the mountains all weekend…You guys have out done yourselves yet again. Just chalk full of knowledge! Really helped me to place some of my rods and add a few more to my wish list.

I did just get a power Kast in Scotto. It needs a good cleaning and some epoxy on the wraps, very dry. It also has a re-wrapped guide just below the female ferrule. Going to see if I can find matching thread and have it redone. Haven’t had the chance to cast it yet though.

While you’re in the giving mood I’ll take a free Phillipson as well!

Thanks for posting this Newmin. A lot of useful info posted because of it. Welcome to the Fiend club.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 27 Nov 2022, 21:12 • #39 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2201
Location: South of Joplin
Well this thread got me motivated to take the Deluxe and the XDFS out today and neither one caught any fish, cold and windy, but nicely overcast . I sure would like the DFS better with a Wells grip, those pointy grips don't suit me.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 08 Dec 2022, 08:44 • #40 
New Member
Joined: 10/11/22
Posts: 18
Location: North eastern PA.
Well...........After I started this post and created a rather interesting discussion, I took the advise of some of you and purchased the D80DFS. It arrived yesterday and it sure is pretty. I did a little lawn casting with it and tried it with a DT5 and 6 and a WF- 5 and 6. The DT-5 was rather nice but a little more time and I'll find out. Of course , seeing that is is rather unusually balmy in PA at this time of year I had to walk out to my pond and try it out. I caught a nice fat , about 15-16" brown, and the rod handled him nicely. More fishing time this spring and I'll have a better idea. It is a good start in my search for MY perfect phillipson. Thanks for the advise!


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 08 Dec 2022, 09:00 • #41 
Piscator
Joined: 08/10/05
Posts: 18333
Location: downtown Bulverde, Texas
Yes, that rod should have the backbone (butt) to handle big trout.
Congrats - you might notice that rod is rated for a DT6 - I would try a Peach - in more modern lines, DT5 might be perfect.


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Re: Eponite advise
Post 08 Dec 2022, 09:10 • #42 
New Member
Joined: 10/11/22
Posts: 18
Location: North eastern PA.
I used a DT 5 and DT 6 in 444 peach and the WF- 5 and WF-6 were SA frequency. It cast all of them well, But casting and fishing are two different beasts. I didn't spend a ton of time on any line. I wanted to wander out to the pond and catch a fish!! I'll spend some serious time with lines another day.


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