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Post 02 Oct 2022, 10:10 • #1 
Guide
Joined: 07/22/20
Posts: 175
Location: Ancient City, Florida
A question I have always wondered. For fishing bigger flies in wind, what are the Pros and cons of say an SA Bass Bug (2 wts heavy) vs over lining with an SA redfish or Grand Slam? Most of my casting is under 60. 30-40 being the most common lately so I have been looking for something that loads faster and will turn over a bigger fly in the marsh.

Thanks!


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Post 02 Oct 2022, 12:46 • #2 
Master Guide
Joined: 01/04/18
Posts: 397
Location: Belair Maryland/Swanton Maryland
Hey g8torwood ,

Either line will do fine ..
You’ll need to experiment with what line plays nice with what rod is being used .
Not sure what rod or fly size your chuckin..

The SA Redfish and Grandslam are pretty close in performance on the graphite rods Ive used them on . (Never used em on glass rods)
Redfish is .5 heavier grand slam is .75 heavier.
Both have the Tropic-core and AST-plus

But at $99 a pop .. you might want to try before you buy .

Since your in Florida.. don’t get a cold water/winter redfish line .
May get too limp in the summertime Florida sun..
I lived in Gainesville Florida for 7years.
What an incredible fishery .
Could chase Stripers in the St. John’s river over by Jacksonville in the morning, fish a few of the North central Bass lakes in the afternoon, and be over on the Gulf side Fishing Cedar Key flats in the evening for specs and big reds ..
Talk about a full day of fishin..

I personally like using saltwater lines for my Bass fishing on tidal marshes and creeks of the Chesapeake Bay .
I have a stash of NOS Sage Equator Taper2 in Wf7
That is my go to Summer Bass line .
The stiffer core is great on windy days and the summer heat..
The tougher coating for harsh saltwater environments is perfect for the slop and swampy areas I stalk .
A lil agentX twice a season and your good to go ..
The taper is a great all around performer.
It’s not super beefy and short like some salt lines .
So it doubles as a great summertime smallmouth line on local freestone creeks also .
You can still find it online here and there ..
Would be a Nice line to use if you chase Suwannee Bass!!

Rio Big Nasty works like a Champ on most rods for Bass buggin . I love the 8wt .

I also use 406 lines in 7WF and 8WF to chase a lot of Spooky Bass .
406 lines have short heads but are true to weight for those times you need a more stealth presentation/finesse in close .
They feature the Sa AST coating so they shoot great if you need to get out to a few fish too.
Sadly 406 doesn’t make a 9wt .. yet!!
Which would be great for 8wt rods that need a lil extra oomph..

Another salt line that I like for Bass fishing is the Cortland 444 Tropic series lines .
I use the 6wt version on several 7wt rods .
It kicks A$$ for popper and hopper fishing just as good at chucking sizable streamers .
Cortland Hi-vis flip tropic lines are great but I use them down the Bay in more salty brackish conditions.
I just scored a spool of the Cortland specialty Bass line in 5wt for creek bassin . No review yet …

There is the older Scientific Anglers lines that came in the Blue-box (late 90s - early 2000s)
And the line is a moss green color.
They did it in an 8wt Saltwater/Bass line that is awesome too .
You can still find it for sale online pretty easy.
I believe this was their AirCel of the day ..
Great feel and loop control . Good all around Bass/lite salt line .
I really like these lines
They have great personality’s..
Not too supple not too stiff ..
They just work!!

Old Sa Headstart 7or8 wt line works fantastic on glass rods if you need something for in super close .

The Sa AirCel “species” lines are great if your on a budget
the Bass 7/8 is awesome . You’d never know it was a $35 line ..

Same with Jim Teeny “First Cast” line which can still be found online for like $40..

Another under the radar on a budget line I like is the Orvis Clearwater lines from 2-3 years ago .
They are .5 heavier .have integrated slickness
Same as SA’s AST without the plus ..
Super Compact Head turns any leader over!
Great Bass line .. you can find it dirt cheap online too. I paid like $20 a pop for mine at the Orvis outlet In Lancaster Pa earlier this year

I have lot of rods .. so paying $100up a line for 300 rods is out of the question for me ..

Hope you find your Goldilocks line for Bustin Big Bass

Scotto


Last edited by ottobahn on 02 Oct 2022, 14:37, edited 1 time in total.

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Post 02 Oct 2022, 14:33 • #3 
Guide
Joined: 07/22/20
Posts: 175
Location: Ancient City, Florida
Great suggestions, thank you. I have too many lines I am not in love with, but nothing really overweight. I do like grandslam on fast graphite. The Iconoglass 8wt just seems to want a bit more weight in close. I firmly admit to liking the feeling of the rod working vs a tip cast.

The Cortland Hi-Viz is appealing because I might be able to see it ;) But as you said, at the prices now, I am a bargain shopper. I do have one older Teeny, but I always put it away when it starts getting warm, way too sticky.

It is a great fishery around here.


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Post 02 Oct 2022, 15:14 • #4 
Guide
Joined: 04/18/20
Posts: 169
Location: Far Western 'burbs of Chicago
It's an interesting question because I think lurking below it is another question/thought:

How does one best build a quiver of fly lines that are capable of enhancing performance for specific fishing tasks while being enough of a 'utility player' to be useful on multiple rods and in multiple scenarios?


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Post 02 Oct 2022, 16:36 • #5 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 09/18/09
Posts: 5561
Location: Relocated to the Drought Stricken West.
Bass bug tapers are "front loaded", so the weight comes very early in the head, This leads to better shooting and better loading at close range.

If you have any wf lines that are 1-3 line weights heavy, you can play with cutting back the front taper. I end up having accumulated a bunch of heavier lines that came off of larger reels that I purchased. I have played with it a bit. I'm sure the new lines are a lot nicer, but at $80 and up, I have a hard time forking over that type of money when the water I bass fish in is often dirty and grimey.

Lines can make a big difference, but I've found it takes playing with different lines to find the right one, and it gets expensive quickly.


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Post 02 Oct 2022, 18:38 • #6 
Master Guide
Joined: 07/21/21
Posts: 447
Location: Florida
For vintage glass 1-6WTs I would use DT lines from Cortland 444 Peach or 406, especially if trout were my target.
Are there better lines out there? Maybe, but if I could only have one fly line it would be between those two.


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Post 02 Oct 2022, 22:19 • #7 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 11/06/17
Posts: 2498
Location: South of Joplin
@G8trwood, I take it that you already own the "Redfish" and the "Grandslam"? and that you wish to substitute one of them instead of buying a "Bass Bug" line?
if that is correct I say use what you have that works with the rod, trial and experimentation work. Those are both half heavy I think so going up one weight would be close to the bass bug at 30" but heavier at 40'. If you have "SA Bonefish" that's true a weight line that I might try. Then again I do all my bass fishing with true weight DT or level lines without any problems. I have a good Bass Bug line that I've used a few times in 20 years.


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Post 03 Oct 2022, 01:03 • #8 
Master Guide
Joined: 01/04/18
Posts: 397
Location: Belair Maryland/Swanton Maryland
Buy the Sa Bass Bug line ..
That Northfork Composites Iconoglass rod he has is a beast .
My old rod builder built a few Iconoglass rods for a customer in Upstate Ny .
He let me cast them in the backyard before shipping them out .
I casted the 8ft 5wt ,8.6ft 6wt, 8wt and the 8.6ft 10wt .
all cannons .. even the 5wt felt like a 7wt ..

G8trwood said it himself.. the redfish and the grand slam aint cutting it and the Iconoglass is begging for more cowbell.
Give him more cowbell !!
The 8.6 8wt rod will love the Bass bug being 2wt over ..
Those rods are really like a solid 9wt rod anyway .
10wt is what I’d probably throw big flies in close or with any wind .
Cheers Scotto


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Post 03 Oct 2022, 09:54 • #9 
Guide
Joined: 07/22/20
Posts: 175
Location: Ancient City, Florida
Thanks Scotto! The rod has a surprising amount of backbone for a floppy tip. Tons of reserve power, but I certainly wouldn’t want glass any faster. Got a pushing 10lb jack on her a few weeks back. What an absolute hoot. I’m glad that wasn’t on the CGR ;)
I was leaning towards the bass bug or titan long. Lining up gives me a heavier running line for more distance in the wind, but that is not my priority. Typically I sit with the 20’ mark at the reel and one backcast and shoot to rising or tailing redfish. At most one false cast. Crabs, shrimp, frog or even a mouse pattern (bass) here and there. I use a 6 wt for the smaller patterns.


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Post 14 Oct 2022, 17:03 • #10 
Sport
Joined: 02/14/18
Posts: 36
Location: Australia, Western Australia
Hi Scotto, What options would you suggest for a clear WF Intermed sink tip for the warmwater stuff to turn over small lead eyed clousers ? Now all the lines are marketed as 5 wts being 185 grns , a 7 wt Titan I bought is 233 grns!!!! Totally lousy for my glass 7 wts. I have an older yellowish fast Intermediate #7 WF ( clear 9 0r 10 ' ) line that is awesome on my 5/6 glass rods . Might be an Airflo (20 yrs old) or a Cortland, but not made any more. I'ts cracking up badly now.
There seem to be no cheap clear sink tips . My 5 to 6 yr old S.A Clear tip Saltwater 7 (205 gns ) and 8 (225) gns are excellent, but no longer made. These are good on my strong 6 and 7 wt rods thanks, Dave


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Post 21 Oct 2022, 23:56 • #11 
Master Guide
Joined: 01/04/18
Posts: 397
Location: Belair Maryland/Swanton Maryland
Hey Davedog ,
Excellent question on intermediate lines .

Back in the day I always used Cortland 333 intermediate for everything sub surface .

Then I rocked SA GPX “hover” line on a lot of my graphite rods slinging streamers to tidal bass with great success .

I believe this has morphed into the MPX Sonar intermediate line series ..
Haven’t tried the MPX sonar version yet .

On my glass rods that carry some line to cast say 50ft where I want maximum accuracy I really really like Royal Wulff “Bermuda triangle” intermediate.
I like the loading of the TT line when I’ve got more line out vs a WF line . For when I’m casting line but not shooting line ..

I’ve really been impressed with Cortland’s
newer generation/revamped lines since 2018+.
I’m a big fan of the tropic plus series of lines .
The 444 tropic is very nice and doesn’t get limp and sticky in the heat like 444peach does
G8torwood said the Jim Teeny line does the same thing in the heat .. ( the old teeny lines were made on the 444 outer jacket/coating )

My buddy Mark swears by the Tropic Plus intermediate for his Brackish Striper Pursuits.
He’s one of the most hardcore Striper addicts I know ..
I can attest the tropic plus coating is not a gimmick!!

Wulff Bermuda Triangle and Cortland tropic plus intermediate both have a sink rate of about 1.75ips

Wulff Bermuda Triangle has a 30ft head/taper
The Cortland TP intermediate has 41ft head

The Cortland TP intermediate 8wt is 210 grains
This might be the ticket …

I’ve also heard good things about Monic intermediate lines but never tried them .

Do you guys get Northern Sport Fly lines in Australia?
Figured being made in UK and Canada it may be popular down under?
I’m very impressed with a few of their private label lines sold here in the United States.

Cheers ,Scotto

Ps G8torwood , Did you score that Bassbug2 line for your inconglass rod yet?


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Post 22 Oct 2022, 01:58 • #12 
Sport
Joined: 02/14/18
Posts: 36
Location: Australia, Western Australia
Hi Scotto, Thanks for the quick reply!! Looks like we can get Northern Sport if ordered online from Canada. Shipping has gone berserk in the last 6 months. Getting a flyrod shipped has doubled, and they want 45- 50 dollars to ship a flyline???? i'll really look into a sinktip from Northern Sport private label, otherwis it's a 180.00 Cortland tropics plus ghost 9 perhaps . Cheers from Downunder, Dave


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Post 22 Oct 2022, 03:00 • #13 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 06/21/06
Posts: 3081
Location: Orygun
As mentioned, and as it sounds like you've already discovered, your IG is a very powerful rod. On my 8wt, I really like it with 280-350gr shooting head style lines. Shoot, even with my 10wt, I'm typically throwing 375-450gr shooting heads for tiger muskies & turning over big flies. Most of my fishing with them involves big streamers so I'm always after something that will load fast and turn over junk. That said, they'll still cast a standard weighted WF line but then you definitely lose that "glassy" feel to it.

Also, regarding intermediate lines, which I use a lot of, I typically roll with the Cortland Compact series (400gr for my 10wt IG) or the clear Wulff Ambush (also in 400gr for my 10wt). Once I get around to getting something like that for my 8wt IG, it'll be the 300gr in the Cortland Compact.

I've also been a big fan of the SA Titan taper on my IGs (and my Bandit for that matter)....mostly the Sonar 3D ones, although, they never really last quite as long as my Cortland Compacts.

I haven't built out my 5wt IG yet, but if the 8 and 10 are any indication of the series, they're almost more like an 8+wt and a 10+wt (I've also used my 10 for Albacore here in the PacNW and it handles them with ease--normally 12wt fish).


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Post 22 Oct 2022, 14:52 • #14 
Guide
Joined: 07/22/20
Posts: 175
Location: Ancient City, Florida
Thanks for the addition. I am trying it wit a 9.5 that I have. Definitely like the feel, but falls apart for me at distance. Probably more a factor of stroke length??

I haven’t built the 5 yet, but the 4 is a completely different animal from the 8. Very much has that glass feel and a delight on small streams. Good info on the 10. I was thinking of one for baby Tarpon.


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Post 22 Oct 2022, 21:49 • #15 
Guide
Joined: 07/12/22
Posts: 207
If you can find close outs on the SA Headstart WF or the Rio Outbound short, you can get great deals. They are both short head WFs that will toss bass bugs and indicator rigs as far as you have the backcast room behind you. Bass don’t really care about presentation. In fact, in my opinion, the more noise the better. Piss them off and they will attack. I usually just walk my flies out to the edge of the weed bed. One backcast, slip a little and haul then repeat till you get it where you want it. If you can’t get it far enough, it’s the rod, your casting skill or you need to get the boat closer, not the line. Unless you are fishing from shore. Then you are better off casting along the shoreline to your left and right and keep walking till you find the fish.


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