So, I am a little confused about when you should use Spar Varnish.

When do you use it?? Is it an alternative to say Threadmaster/Flex Coat? Do you use it after you have applied a few coats of Flex Coat?

Thank you for all the replies as always.

Zinny

I like to use varnish for all coats. It’s just much easier to work with when you need to replace a guide. No scraping involved - just remove the wrap and hit the area with some thinnner. I have rods that have been fished quite a bit for 35 plus years and the varnished wraps are still going strong.

Spar provides a “warmer” appearance to the finish as opposed to epoxy. Depending on the appearance you desire it can be of benefit. It can be a little easier to use if you are going for a translucent rather than transparent appearance to your wraps. I also found it easier and more predictable when I was starting to build rods, also easier to fix when I messed up.

I’ve not mixed finishes on a rod but to each their own.

Easier to use, long lasting, beautiful luster and character of the finish. Flexible and easy to touch up or complete a piecemeal wrap repair/replacement. I always use spar varnish. Realize that spar varnish is a proven tough performer in harsh marine environments on sailing vessel rigging (spars) and woodwork throughout such vessels. By comparison, the job it performs on windings is a piece of cake. If a rod receives minimal care--essentially never being put away wet in a sock or tube or stashed wet in a damp place--a spar finish on the wraps may very well outlast the person who applied it. It will definitely long outlast a desire to look at it for details of craft alone.

As to the amber tone--which in some brands is so minimal they look sparkling clear on all but the lightest thread--this is relatively constant. It may mellow, but is actually less likely to develop the weather-checked, "yellow," or UV damaged look of some two part finishes. This was rarely visible on dark graphite blanks as they became common about the same time as two-parts on production rods. It is visible on lighter 'glass blanks. For the hobby builder, the two parts are a solution in search of a problem.

The downsides of either finish type are easy to exaggerate, though, and usually explained by poor application, poor care, or both. We've all done it once or twice. But worst case scenario, a wrap of a guide or entire rod finished with spar is easier to redo, and do right, a second time. After that, it is unlikely it will ever need to be done again.

Zinny, I would suggest searching the forum for posts on transculent/transparent wraps. There is a lot of great info. The type of finish will have an effect on transparency or color retention of the wrap. For varnishes (oil based), most spars will turn the wrap pretty translucent, polyurethanes will retain quite a bit more of the color (in some cases almost as much as color preserver), and spar urathanes are somewhere in between the two. I have never tried water based varnishes, but I have read they retain much of the color similar or more so than oil based poly.

Epoxy will also make the wraps transparent/translucent. Some bamboo builders will use thinned epoxy for the first few coatings to get clear or vary transparent wraps, then use varnish for the remaining coats. Some find it easier to get more transparent wraps with epoxy than varnish. I personally use a spar/walnut oil mixture, but it’s time consuming, followed up with spar uthathane.

The quest for translucency can be a bit of a double edged sword as it can exposure faults in wrapping technique. Too tight of wraps, voids, tie off points might produce what is called the shimmers (voids and air pockets in then wraps).

Silk vs. nylon - it can depend on color, size, and finish selected, but I feel that silk in general can be more transparent. But in some colors and sizes it can pretty darn similar.

Judging by your recent posts, it might appear this one of your first builds. If so, I might suggest keeping it simple. If you want to try varnish, I might suggest trying Helmsman spar urathane, and calling it good.

A neat trick that makes nice looking wraps is to put down a layer of spar urethane first then epoxy over it which is what I did with these on a Kabuto 805 I just finished:


It looks really good if you're using thread colors in the browns or reds.

Thanks! That is some original Gudebrod black & gold jasper I got from Ricks Rods.

I couldn't seem to avoid shimmers and voids when using spar on the first coat. So I did 3 coats of spar over top of 1 soaking coat of TM lite and that seemed to work. Except for a bit less luster, you couldn't really tell it wasn't all spar. I did like the extra depth the multiple layers of spar gave it. As far as I could tell, it still gave it the nice warm tint.

Good thread here with lots of back-and-forth sharing and comparing notes. Reminds me of the "old days" on this forum. :-).

I use spar only and that's all i've used in my brief tenure as a hobby rodbuilder. I like that is easily available, cheap, and i am more than satisfied with the results.

Like Tiptop, I find spar requires a day or more between coats. And I apply as many as 6 coats. The trick is to apply sparingly and allow the thread to soak up the varnish.

I pour varnish into a shot glass with a few drops of mineral spirits or turpentine. Put it on with a toothpick a drop at a time. Touch the drop of varnish, lightly, to the thread, and carefully spread it to completely cover the wrap.

On the first coat all I want is to soak the thread with varnish. You can tell it's soaked when it turns a darker shade. Your individual thread wraps will be visible. Leave it alone. Wait at least 24 hrs. Repeat.

John, I use Ace Brand Spar Varnish too. I tried more expensive brand names but I didn't see they were any better, so went back to Ace.

So I tried Spar Varnish last night and it dried very wavy? I assume I used too much?

Ya gotta go thin with spar. Even if it cures fully, you'll get bad edge build if you go on too heavy.

The following isn't quite "true" literally, but is nevertheless a good way to think of it: with just about any finish, it is difficult to put it on too little. If you do, the next coat takes care of that. If you try to put on too little, you are more likely to put on about enough. It is very hard to put on too little; it is very easy to put on too much. Essentially, if you can see it as a "coat" other than just a glossy, wet appearance, it is too much.