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Epic 476 guide spacing
Post 08 Oct 2017, 19:52 • #1 
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I am starting to build an Epic 476 rod. I have a question regarding guide spacing. The manual provided with the kit is not clear.

Is spacing on these rods measured from the tip of the rod or do you install the tip top and then measure from the tip of the tip top? Thanks for your help.


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Post 08 Oct 2017, 19:59 • #2 
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Joined: 09/18/09
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Location: Relocated to the Drought Stricken West.
Is the difference that big?
I would do it without the tiptop and make sure the guides don't end over the ferrule and make minor tweeks from there.

The guide might end up sharing a wrap with the ferrule wrap, but the guide foot should be at least .025" away from the ferrule

Masking tape them on and see how it looks.

Carl


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Post 09 Oct 2017, 06:01 • #3 
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Now there is more than one way to do it, BUT traditionally, the tiptop is guide "0," and it adds approximately 1/4" to the length of the tip section, so I think it is best to start your measurements with the tiptop on. One-quarter inch is not a lot in the great scheme of things but having it on there helps to keep the guides aligned, and do the preliminary static test.

Epoch blanks are very well-made, so their suggested spacing should be very close to perfect even before you do the static test. I do have a problem with their guide sizing, but you can't go wrong with factory specs to start.


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Post 09 Oct 2017, 07:55 • #4 
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grandemange,

Drop Epic a note for their answer if you are concerned. They are really good to work with.

I usually lay the tape measure out next to the blank and put the guides on the table there too so I can see where they are going to be. If you are not familiar with the static deflection test, just google "fly rod static deflection" and read up. As Archfly mentioned. Epic blanks are well made and consistent so the guide placement should be good out of the box.

From a quick scan of the intertubes, the following page seems to have a good description of static deflection testing. It's from the US importer of Fuji guides.
http://anglersresource.net/StaticLoadTutorial.aspx
It takes some of the mystery out of guide placement. It isn't rocket science.

This reminds me that I have a 5pc epic that I have to wrap now that winter is setting in.

Carl


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Post 09 Oct 2017, 15:10 • #5 
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Joined: 01/09/17
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Thanks to both of you for the input and help. Ill probably drop Epic a line to see for sure. This is my first rod build and I've seen videos with people measuring both ways even with epic rods. I would rather have it correct since Epic rods seem to be pretty dialed in on measurements they provide, and for the price I want to do it correctly. As i slowly progress through the build I will reach out here with more questions. I have a fear this will become an addiction. My wife already said if I want to build another rod I can if I can sell it. The flood gates may have been opened. :lol


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Post 10 Oct 2017, 07:20 • #6 
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I will suggest another way to channel your building urge, other than a spouse's concern. Your builds will be best and you will learn the most if you do them one at a time with a purposeful pause between each build--let's say a fishing season. Replicating errors, even on a very good build, or overlooking potential enhancements--that is what happens when you go at it willy-nilly. Live with one build for a while by fishing it regularly. Whatever you like about the way you did it will come out even better on the next one. Whatever you don't like, whether cosmetic or a component/finish failure, you won't do again. You will have less performance anxiety as well because one build at a time done with reasonable care will always produce a usable rod. I'm sure your first rod will convince you of that regardless of 1/4" of guide spacing.


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Post 10 Oct 2017, 16:00 • #7 
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Official word from Swift on their Epic rod guide spacing is:

"measurements are from the tip of the blank to the centre of the guide."


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Post 10 Oct 2017, 19:07 • #8 
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Yep, I measured mine from the tip of the blank. Just finished my 476 about a month ago, fished it twice now and really like it. VERY smooth.

Couple tips for you...

1. Thin your varnish. I did the first coat thinned 50/50 like the instructions indicated but did the second coat unthinned. Problem was, once I got to the last 3-4 guides, the unthinned varnish was starting to really thicken. I should have stopped and mixed a new batch, but didn’t and it went on really thick and I got the football look to a few of the guide feet. The last coat I thinned it a bit (not 50/50, I just splashed a bit of alcohol in it) and it went on much smoother. Lesson is: several thin coats will look better than a couple of thick coats.

2. Sable brushes > cheep plastic brushes on the kit. Those plastic brushes will do the trick, but I got some sable brushes from the local hobby store and they worked much better. Had much more control.

3. That tip top guide, it’s really loose on the tip of the blank. Try to Center it on the blank as best as you can before the epoxy sets. I had mine pressed up against the blank on one side, which made a big gap on the opposite side that I had to fill with varnish. It would look better if the gap around the tip top and blank were more consistent all the way around. I’ll be more careful next time.

4. That Epic logo on the butt section, it’s not supposed to be facing up when you epoxy the handle on. It’s supposed to be on the right side of the blank when you set the reel seat in place. I missed that little detail in the instructions and noticed it after it was all epoxied together. Certainly doesn’t affect performance, but I’m a bit of a perfectionist...

Good luck! I already have my eye on a 480 for the next build...


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Post 10 Oct 2017, 19:43 • #9 
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Do the Epic kits come with the spine marked? If not, the position of the label is cosmetic only. If the butt section has a distinct spine that would be the best choice, and the label would wind up where-ever it happened to be relative to the spine. As to the tiptop, was it too large for the blank provided such that the next size down would fit ? If not, but loose fitting, what I would do is create a spiral shim with nylon thread, maybe as small as flytying thread, or even just use 6x tippet materiel, fine sewing thread--just enough for a snug, centered fit and to retain ferrule cement or a mild, heat-releasable epoxy.


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Post 10 Oct 2017, 21:14 • #10 
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None of the sections have the spine marked, the instructions leave it to the builder to decide if they want to spine the rod. But, they also say there is no need to spine the butt section, so yes the logo placement is simply aesthetic.

And good idea on the tip top, next time I will add some material to shim the blank a bit so it is centered. I presume the size of the tip top they sent is appropriate since it came in the kit and the components are pretty high quality all around.


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Post 12 Oct 2017, 21:43 • #11 
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Joined: 02/06/15
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Quote:
And good idea on the tip top, next time I will add some material to shim the blank a bit so it is centered.


Something I did one time was just wrap 2 or 3 turns of thread on the tip section so it would be just inside the barrel of the tiptop. Worked like a charm.


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