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Post 03 Jul 2017, 19:44 • #1 
Master Guide
Joined: 02/09/13
Posts: 637
Location: US-TX
I have broken the male end of a tip over butt ferrule rod at the ferrule twice now. Combination of user error (overbending) and pieces not seating deeply enough probably.

I have now sanded the parts so the two sections seat 2" deep like the other sections and repaired again with a stint and I want to wrap the male end of the tip over butt where the 2 pieces meet but am wondering if anyone here has gone down this road and found problems with wrapping the male end. (i.e will the wrap make it more likely that the rod will snap right at the ferrule juncture next time I pull a bonehead move?)

By the way, the material is graphite.


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Post 03 Jul 2017, 22:25 • #2 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 09/18/09
Posts: 5566
Location: Relocated to the Drought Stricken West.
Are you wrapping to protect the stent or for some other reason? The only problem I see is that the wrap will get in the way of the tip coming down. Just like a spiggot, the male section of a tip over butt ferrule will wear and the tip will come down a bit further. If the wrap is in the way, that would be bad.

I have no personal experience with that. I've had the factory replace a section for me. I had to send the rod in and they fit the third section on a 4pc blank. It turned out great. I can't imagine doing this sort of patch on a rod I'm going to use for a long time. Decent graphite blanks are just too cheap, and real high end blanks won't be the same after the fix (and are worth having a new section made)


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Post 04 Jul 2017, 05:49 • #3 
Master Guide
Joined: 11/28/15
Posts: 378
Location: US-NC
As Gary Loomis has said, don't do "bonehead" moves. He has an excellent blog on graphite rod breakage and how to tell if it was operator error or some monster fish which caused the rod to break. I recently built a new rod for a friend who broke his old one, supposedly on a 12" Smallmouth (I saw the fish.) The break was indicative of being cracked, possibly on the metal rail of the boat, before he had the fish on.

In any case, thread wrapping the male end is not advised, there has to be solid graphite to graphite contact, and the natural taper of the blank will still allow proper seating when worn. Is it possible the joint loosened during use and slid upwards creating additional stress.? I've seen that on a 4-piece St. Croix I have. If that's the problem, use a little beeswax on the male end before seating it.

I haven't yet received a report on how the new rod performed on this friend's recent Walleye trip.

BB


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Post 04 Jul 2017, 06:51 • #4 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 04/20/07
Posts: 8931
Location: US-ME
Are you wanting to wrap it just below the point the female seats to? And is the purpose to reinforce the blanks around the lower end of the inserted stent? I don't see any harm in that; it is, essentially, the same that is done around a spigot. Just be sure to leave enough of the male exposed for the female to seat.

That said, I would call that rod an experiment, and I doubt it will fix the problem for long. Something else in rod handling or assembly of the ferrule is causing the repeated breakage. Identify that problem and make a change or it will be repeated, if not with that rod, another. If you wind up replacing that rod--as Carl said--graphite blanks are a dime a dozen--you don't want to repeat the problem.

Remember that ferrules of this type are not to be push fit with continuous pressure as in cylindrical metal ferrules. They are elongated conical mating surfaces that maintain the connection between sections by mild friction over a large area. Lightly slide the one over the over. Push snug. No forcing.

If you batter your tackle around or cast herky jerky or with a twist or cant, check for snugness as a habit, let's say each time you reel up completely, light a cigar, or whatever fishing habit comes at 20 minute intervals.


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Post 04 Jul 2017, 10:21 • #5 
Master Guide
Joined: 02/09/13
Posts: 637
Location: US-TX
WP: I am doing what you referred to-below the point the female seats to.

The pieces either never fit well (deep) or quit fitting deep at some point. I over-bent the rod and snapped it. When I repaired it with a stint the first time, I did not fix the big problem-it was not seating deeply (only one inch, whereas the other pieces of the rod seat at alittle more rhan 2 ").

So, having snapped it a 2nd time at the exact same place and stented it again, this time I sanded down the paint finish on the male end and now the female seats 2" in and actually over the old breaks.

This is not a high end rod blank and so I am just patching it as well as I can.

Bonehead moves and my breaking graphite rods usually go hand in hand with fatigue after/during long marches into wilderness.


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Post 04 Jul 2017, 11:40 • #6 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 09/18/09
Posts: 5566
Location: Relocated to the Drought Stricken West.
WT,
Let us know how it works out.

Time to be on the lookout for a new blank. It's not worth the effort, and if you are using this to march in, it definitely isn't worth going in with a rod that is suspect.

Was this originally a custom build? I am wondering if that female ferrule was wrapped to tightly to begin with. I have a rod that always comes undone at the same ferrule every time. I suspect that I wrapped that ferrule too tightly, but it might just be that blank. It was a blem.


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Post 04 Jul 2017, 14:34 • #7 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 04/12/07
Posts: 1296
Location: western Massachusetts
With tip-over ferrules, it is not customary to wrap the male ferrule end. Many builders do put a wrap on there, however, so they have a surface to place the alignment dot. When doing this, it is customary to place the wrap one inch below the ferrule join to allow for wear.

If you have sanded the male ferrule so that there is two inches of bearing, you probably have corrected the problem. Putting a wrap one inch below the joined ferrule should be optional, but putting a wrap there should do no harm.

It sounds like you have a bad blank, and should talk to whomever sold it to you, or the factory.


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Post 04 Jul 2017, 15:28 • #8 
Master Guide
Joined: 02/09/13
Posts: 637
Location: US-TX
Being a natural tinkerer, this is right up my alley. I think I have corrected the problem and the ferules seat well now so this pack rod will go back in rotation. I am not going to put a wrap on the male ferule.

I know its graphite, but it has a good flexing action that I appreciate.

I always carry a backup since I am prone to break my rods, at least when they are graphite.

Thanks all for your help.


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Post 05 Jul 2017, 17:51 • #9 
Glass Fanatic
Joined: 06/23/05
Posts: 4971
Location: US-MT
On the early Fenwick tip/over/butt rods, they wrapped the male just below where the female seated.


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