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Post 14 Apr 2013, 22:08 • #1 
Sport
Joined: 03/18/09
Posts: 30
Location: US-NJ
I stopped by my local Orvis shop this weekend for some backing and the guy who helped me said that Orvis has some new glass rods coming out. He didn't know the line weight range or specifically say when they were going to be released but that the new line has been "fish" tested. Has anyone else heard of Orvis rolling out some new glass rods?


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Post 14 Apr 2013, 22:10 • #2 
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Joined: 02/02/09
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Location: People's Republic of Austin
I've heard nothing, but that could be huge.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 00:06 • #3 
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Joined: 12/04/11
Posts: 6
Location: US-OR
Dear God! If they would only come out with 'spey' switch rods in the 11-12 foot range. Fellows couldn't build them fast enough. A couple of years back Steve Godshall found some (an educated guess) 9wt 11' glass rods and I had him build me a spey 'switch rod.'

With his custom cut line this turns out to be a 6/7 2hander. Amazing 'all day' rod for Steelhead fishing with poly sink tips. Three'ish weeks back another fisherman asked if he could cast the rod; 'why not?' Was two'ish hours before he handed same back to me.

Sandy, my Yellow Lab,and I just sat on the beach and took a long nap. Obvious I wasn't getting the 'tool' back any time soon. Even took my waders off; no point in keeping them on.

Sandy muched on Dog Cookies, I had the last half of a Subway Sandwich as we watched line float over the upper Rogue River. Magic, pure magic.

"To sleep, perchance to dream? That is the question,. ... "


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 07:17 • #4 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/15/06
Posts: 804
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Jim West says they're still in R&D. Everyone who knows Orvis dealers, reps, or guides should ask them--sooner or later we'll find a field tester or two that we can get some details from.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 08:57 • #5 
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Joined: 12/27/11
Posts: 435
Location: US-MA
Orvis getting back into glass is huge and could potentially have a significant impact on the small glass builders. Good or bad. i've heard Orvis is going to start selling made in the U.S reels also, a step in the right direction for it's fly fishing business imo.

can't help but wonder if Orvis glass will be "fast for glass" or if they'll favor the classic Phillipson Action; or what type glass S or E they'll use and if they'll go with uni with scrim or a warp bias weave.

Great news.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 09:13 • #6 
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Joined: 12/29/10
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Location: Osage Orange Range, North Texas, US
Quote:
Jim West says they're still in R&D.

Thank you for sharing that with us, Cross Creek, and very on-point question, Baker. Think the blanks will be rolled in Manchester, Seoul, or Shenzen?


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 09:32 • #7 
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Joined: 06/01/12
Posts: 343
Location: East TN
Normally, I would say it is good news as more glass rods will be available, but it kinda makes me cringe coming for Orvis , or Sage if that were to happen. Orvis stuff, with a couple of infrequent exceptions, seems to be typically mediocre and overpriced, but still sells because of the name. Could do damage to the perception of glass.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 10:54 • #8 
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Joined: 10/07/11
Posts: 692
Location: SE MA
I think it would be great if Orvis returned to selling fiberglass rods. I personally feel that they would do a good job of it, especially if they were to be the actual builders. I own or have handled quite a few Orvis rods in bamboo, fiberglass, and graphite and found them to be very pleasurable.

Besides, I'm into instant gratification. The thought of going into my local Orvis dealer and being able to actually look at and to test cast a glass rod certainly beats ordering a rod and waiting months for it to arrive; and all the time wondering how it is going to cast for you once it does.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 11:01 • #9 
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Joined: 04/15/06
Posts: 804
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Since the average fly fisherman's perception of glass is governed by those godawful yellow contraptions that Wright & McGill has been selling for the past two or three years, anything Orvis puts on the market couldn't possible make it worse :)

Orvis certainly could roll the blanks for these rods in Manchester, but there are some decent blanks being made overseas now, too. Wherever in Asia Cortland is having the "new" Diamondglass rods made is a possibility, and CTS (New Zealand) would certainly be able to produce blanks every bit as nice as anything Orvis could roll in house. The key ingredients will be taper, choice of scrim, and resin--the rest is largely mechanical, and the machinery isn't exactly rocket science these days. Personally, I just hope they are making a serious commitment, and not just planning to market a couple of shortish 5wts for kids and brush-busting. I'd like to see S glass used to make something like the Superfine range, only with two piece models, but that may be a bridge too far.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 11:14 • #10 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/08/09
Posts: 676
Location: Vermont
I was surprised at how slow the Superfine Touch rods were, and I'd like to see what they might offer in 'glass. I'd hate for it to hurt the smaller builders though. I'm interested to see how things will turn out.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 11:21 • #11 
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Joined: 02/19/08
Posts: 2462
Location: Seattle, WA
Cross Creek wrote:
Since the average fly fisherman's perception of glass is governed by those godawful yellow contraptions that Wright & McGill has been selling for the past two or three years, anything Orvis puts on the market couldn't possible make it worse :)

Orvis and Eagle Claw serve separate groups of fly fishers. Granted the latest EC Featherlight isn't a high brow, top of the line rod but for a mere $25 there's little room for complaint. It's a fun and competent rod. There are many terribly worse vintage rods out there than the current model of EC Featherlight. Now if you were complaining about some of the slightly older EC rods, Featherlights included, you'd have a perfectly acceptable beef.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 12:19 • #12 
Sport
Joined: 03/18/09
Posts: 30
Location: US-NJ
CC,
The guy at the dealer, though not specific, seemed to imply that the rods were at the end of the R&D process and almost ready to hit the shelves at Orvis shops. I'm not saying that what Jim told you is wrong by any stretch just relaying the tone of my conversation at the store which I could have misread.

I think the only reason the guy even mentioned it to me is because he let me cast the current Orvis Superfines against my vintage ones and my glass rods. I'm also guessing not too many people are walking in with vintage reels asking for backing.

I don't know how connected he is with Orvis R&D but I'll stop by in the next two weeks and ask if he might be able to get his hands on one. It never hurts to ask.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 12:21 • #13 
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Joined: 04/02/13
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Location: Milwaukee, WI
mcfly wrote:
Normally, I would say it is good news as more glass rods will be available, but it kinda makes me cringe coming for Orvis , or Sage if that were to happen. Orvis stuff, with a couple of infrequent exceptions, seems to be typically mediocre and overpriced, but still sells because of the name. Could do damage to the perception of glass.

I agree completely. I used to be a fan of Orvis about 10 years ago when I bought a great pair of waders. But once they wore out, in only about 4 seasons of light use, I tried three times in three successive years to buy a decent new pair from them, with horrible experiences every time. The only thing I can say good about the company is that they kept their word about exchanging them, and finally giving my money back. For what it's worth, I use Simms waders now.

Orvis seems to be turning into the North Face of fly fishing. Slapping their name on something and expecting hipsters to not notice how crappy it's getting in spite of the high price tag.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 13:04 • #14 
Master Guide
Joined: 12/09/11
Posts: 888
Location: Athens GA
I can't speak up about many of Orvis products but I've been impressed with:

Orvis Access Fly rods
Battenkill and Battenkill Bar Stock reels
Superstrong tippet material
Orvis customer service

And when they release their new click-pawl reel, I bet it'll be a honey!

Jim


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 13:48 • #15 
Master Guide
Joined: 04/27/09
Posts: 573
Location: US-SD
The Orvis fiberglass rods built from Phillipson blanks were really good ones. For reasons unknown to me this type of blanks do not seem to be produced anymore, but if an outfit like Orvis could tool up to put them back in the line-up I believe it would be a fine thing. The later fiberglass rods from Orvis (with the brown blanks) were OK but did not seem to me to be as nice as the earlier yellow rods. I have never used any of the greenish Golden Eagle rods, but I understand these were also Phillipson blanks, so are probably good ones to shoot for also.


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 14:48 • #16 
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Joined: 06/11/06
Posts: 2516
Location: Nature Coast Florida
Not sure but I think the Golden Eagle rods were Orvis tapers that Phillipson made for them. I loved my Para/Metrics, but I would have given them all up in a second for a set of Golden Eagle rods. The 7 1/2' was one of the best 5 wts I've ever seen and although I can't remember the exact length I had a ten weight Golden Eagle that was as good as it ever came in heavy weight glass rods.

I've had the after Phillipson yellow Orvis Glass and although many folks seem to like them just as well I just didn't get it.

I don't know how Orvis would ever get back to making the Golden Eagles since Phillipson long gone, but it would be sweet.

I think price would be the big thing, you can pick up Orvis Bamboo for $350 and up and as much as I like glass, when I get in that price range its going to be Orvis bamboo everytime, all the time. Thats the reason I don't have a Golden Eagles around, people kept offering me enough money for them that I could buy another Orvis bamboo.

Barry


Last edited by GRASSNGLASS on 16 Apr 2013, 12:44, edited 1 time in total.

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Post 15 Apr 2013, 16:33 • #17 
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Joined: 04/26/12
Posts: 1778
Location: Dubois Pa
nielson wrote:
I can't speak up about many of Orvis products but I've been impressed with:

Orvis Access Fly rods
Battenkill and Battenkill Bar Stock reels
Superstrong tippet material
Orvis customer service

And when they release their new click-pawl reel, I bet it'll be a honey!

Jim

I will let you know I am picking up the New Click and Pawl Battenkill tomorrow at my local dealer

Bob


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Post 15 Apr 2013, 19:01 • #18 
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Joined: 11/25/09
Posts: 2319
I think this is very good news. Orvis, love them or hate them have a very loyal following and this hopefully will introduce some people to Fiberglass that would never be introduced otherwise.

I am however surprised, most of these modern companies say "they are not going to look back." Sage just made a new series in the Circa with new technology (nice casting rod though) when they really should have never gotten rid of the LL or the SPL's. Just why Orvis is using higher modulus graphite for their new Superfines, when there wasn't anything that could be improved upon with the original series.

Although with the new advancements to Glass maybe they look at this as not looking back.

Dusty


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Post 16 Apr 2013, 02:44 • #19 
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Joined: 12/26/09
Posts: 1106
Location: Richmond, TX
Cameron wrote:
This morning I posted a big piece on T.F.M. on where I see contemporary glass heading over the next twelve to eighteen months.

http://thefiberglassmanifesto.blogspot.. .. reams.html

Check out the post if you don't mind please comment here or there on what you'd like to see the fly rod industry take notice of and develop in regards to glass. There is a good chance that what I'm looking forward to might be different than what you're hoping for. Great for me to see all sides of it.

When Cameron commented in his TFM blog noted above that "a safe prediction is that in the next twelve to eighteen months I believe we'll see at least six (likely more like eight) fly rod companies either completely redesign their current glass offerings, reintroduce glass after a several decades long hiatus, or the introduction of new fly rods that we've never seen before from a company that's never offered glass", maybe one of the companies that he was speaking about "reintroducing glass after a several decades long hiatus" is Orvis?

Andrew.


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Post 16 Apr 2013, 04:54 • #20 
Administrator
Joined: 07/17/06
Posts: 5599
Location: South Carolina
fredaevans wrote:
Dear God! If they would only come out with 'spey' switch rods in the 11-12 foot range. Fellows couldn't build them fast enough.

fredaevans ... standby ... Orvis is not likely working on a spey/switch project in glass but I know of a couple other companies that are. One company that I am aware of is hoping to do something in the $300-400 price tag and should be pretty good.


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Post 16 Apr 2013, 04:58 • #21 
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Joined: 07/17/06
Posts: 5599
Location: South Carolina
a f Baker wrote:
Orvis getting back into glass is huge and could potentially have a significant impact on the small glass builders.

a f Baker ... there have been a couple threads on FFR lately that fear for the small glass builders when a big company talks about getting back into glass. I've yet to talk to a builder that has mentioned worry about this. If anything they welcome it since it gives them yet another company to lean on for blanks for their own builds.

Customers who are looking for a custom glass fly rod and those who are looking for a factory build are typically not the same customer. Or they are and have the coin to buy both custom and factory fly rods for their collection.


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Post 16 Apr 2013, 05:08 • #22 
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Joined: 07/17/06
Posts: 5599
Location: South Carolina
rewynd wrote:
Cameron wrote:
This morning I posted a big piece on T.F.M. on where I see contemporary glass heading over the next twelve to eighteen months.

http://thefiberglassmanifesto.blogspot.. .. reams.html

When Cameron commented in his TFM blog noted above that "a safe prediction is that in the next twelve to eighteen months I believe we'll see at least six (likely more like eight) fly rod companies either completely redesign their current glass offerings, reintroduce glass after a several decades long hiatus, or the introduction of new fly rods that we've never seen before from a company that's never offered glass", maybe one of the companies that he was speaking about "reintroducing glass after a several decades long hiatus" is Orvis?

Andrew.

Andrew ... I might have to go back and edit that post to say in the next six months instead of eighteen months. HA ... There is just so much going on in the glass realm both on the larger company side and small shop side of things.

I just hope that if Orvis brings back glass that they put some time into a video as cool as this telling the story of why they are getting back into glass and how and where these fly rods are made. This video profiles Shawn Combs who is a product designer at Orvis and has had his hands deep into projects like the Helios 2 and the Silver Sonic waders.

http://youtu.be/gjZEM1rClnE

Check 42 seconds in. He reads TFM too ... so maybe we're getting in his brain ...


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Post 16 Apr 2013, 13:18 • #23 
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Joined: 02/02/09
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Location: People's Republic of Austin
Cameron wrote:
Check 42 seconds in. He reads TFM too ... so maybe we're getting in his brain ...

That's very cool.


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Post 16 Apr 2013, 15:20 • #24 
Master Guide
Joined: 12/18/11
Posts: 351
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Cameron wrote:
fredaevans wrote:
Dear God! If they would only come out with 'spey' switch rods in the 11-12 foot range. Fellows couldn't build them fast enough.

fredaevans ... standby ... Orvis is not likely working on a spey/switch project in glass but I know of a couple other companies that are. One company that I am aware of is hoping to do something in the $300-400 price tag and should be pretty good.

Time to start saving up some money again. Can't wait to find out about this. Please keep us posted Cam.


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Post 16 Apr 2013, 15:52 • #25 
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Joined: 11/24/06
Posts: 1507
Location: Beautiful View, WA
rewynd wrote:
Cameron wrote:
This morning I posted a big piece on T.F.M. on where I see contemporary glass heading over the next twelve to eighteen months.

http://thefiberglassmanifesto.blogspot.. .. reams.html

Check out the post if you don't mind please comment here or there on what you'd like to see the fly rod industry take notice of and develop in regards to glass. There is a good chance that what I'm looking forward to might be different than what you're hoping for. Great for me to see all sides of it.

When Cameron commented in his TFM blog noted above that "a safe prediction is that in the next twelve to eighteen months I believe we'll see at least six (likely more like eight) fly rod companies either completely redesign their current glass offerings, reintroduce glass after a several decades long hiatus, or the introduction of new fly rods that we've never seen before from a company that's never offered glass", maybe one of the companies that he was speaking about "reintroducing glass after a several decades long hiatus" is Orvis?

Andrew.

Yeah, when I read that, I thought about Orvis and Winston as the top candidates for re-intro after long hiatus. I doubt Sage will do it given their market leadership and huge momentum in graphite. They're just leaving the rest behind. So the other guys might decide to throw some fun curve-balls ... like glass.


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